FFA silliness: The protests and boycotts thread

[furns]

Our response


So Rebecca Wilson is at it again, this time with her good mate Alan Jones, who decided it was a good idea to throw some more dirt on the football fraternity. Its been a while since the last muckraking article, so it was time to throw another hand grenade on the barbie. Only this time it seems to have backfired spectacularly.

Firstly, Wilson decided it was a great idea to write an article that was front page on The Sunday Telegraph 22nd Nov edition, with pictures of 140 of 198 football supporters being branded as “louts” and “footballs shame”. While we dont disagree that there are people on that banned list that deserve to be there, the major issue was the outing of people who have never been charged with a crime, have had no avenue (until today apparently) to appeal, and some are even under 18 years of age – which is actually a criminal offence.

Then to rub salt into the wound, Rebecca Wilson (who has been a noted anti-football voice in the media for years) then went onto Alan Jones 2GB program to pump up the article and get her congratulatory slap on the back from Alan who then, incredulously likened the FFA’s handling of “football violence” to (Alan’s right wing assessment of) French authorities dealing with the terrorist attacks in Paris. A reprehensible statement to make, and one that is absolutely offensive to anyone in the football family. We have been putting up with various instances of offensive media stories over the years from the Anti-Football Mafia (Rebecca Wilson, Channel 7 and the Daily Telegraph and Herald Sun being the main protagonists), and it appears that people have finally had enough.

A number of other supporters groups around the league intend to stage boycotts or walkouts during the A-League round this weekend, but we feel that this course of action is playing directly into the Anti-Football Mafia’s hands and only disadvantages the clubs we love to support. So what we plan to do instead is to call on all football supporters to hit these bastards where it hurts – in the hip pocket.

What we are propose is to mount a football wide mass email campaign to flood these organisations with feedback from as many football fans across Australia and New Zealand as possible to call for the removal of Rebecca Wilson from the NewsCorp organisation and any media outlet that hosts her, as well as a front page apology from the Daily Telegraph for the wrongful publishing of peoples details and branding all football supporters in the same light as a extremely small minority. You can also tweet or FB message these media outlets and other shows (like Offsiders, Sports Night on Sky News Channel, SEN, etc)

We are also calling for an immediate boycott of all NewsCorp publications both in print and online versions, dont buy their papers, do not give your clicks any of their articles as these generate revenue and website traffic.

Except for FoxSports Football – they’re alright those guys.

We will also be calling for same response for Alan Jones by emailing 2GB and most importantly all of 2GB’s sponsors for them to pull their financial support or lobby the station for Alan to retract his comments and give an on-air apology on his radio show, and that he also be removed from the board of the SCG Trust.

We will be announcing commencement of the email campaign shortly – we are attempting to streamline the process for supporters to eliminate the need to send separate emails to multiple addresses. We will announce when its ready to go. Feel free however to begin tweeting and messaging these outlets via Facebook to get the ball rolling.

While Squadron Novocastria will not be engaging in a silent protest, walk out or boycott, we will make our feelings on the matter known at the home game against Brisbane this Saturday. We join in the disgust we are all feeling that all supporters of our world game have been tarred with the same brush thanks to a few morons who have been rightly dealt with.

The FFA will not get away scot-free from this debacle either, as their banning process leaves much to be desired (despite their protestations to the contrary) and until this whole mess hit the headlines there was no confirmed avenue of appeal for those who had previously been banned. Most supporters have been rightly removed from the game due to criminal or violent activity, there is no dispute that a banning process is required. However what we also have are some supporters who have been wrongly banned who have had no right of appeal, or access to the evidence that was used to ban them.

Representatives from Squadron Novocastria are working behind the scenes with other football groups from across the A-League to actively & directly lobby the FFA to improve and formalise the banning system on behalf of all football supporters and actually make it a transparent process, rather than the secret structure with no publicised guidelines as it exists now.

They will Never Tear Us Apart

Squadron Novocastria

[Jeterpool]

How strong of a symbol would it be if home and away fans walked in a march pre game together

[Jetmaster]

How strong of a symbol would it be if home and away fans walked in a march pre game together

Is that what Bozza just alluded to on Shootout?

[belchardo]

How strong of a symbol would it be if home and away fans walked in a march pre game together

Depends. The message I reckon that would send is "we support the 198, even though we know most of them deserve suspensions"

Best thing I think could happen is that supporter groups go quiet, talk to the ffa on the side. Nobody is looking good during this.

[Jeterpool]

Is that what Bozza just alluded to on Shootout?

Yep.

[Jeterpool]

Depends. The message I reckon that would send is "we support the 198, even though we know most of them deserve suspensions"

Best thing I think could happen is that supporter groups go quiet, talk to the ffa on the side. Nobody is looking good during this.

It doesn't have to be that. It can show that both sides of football can come together.

[lquiquer]

@KevinAirs442: FFA Nov 4: “No right of appeal”
FFA Nov 26: “Always been a right of appeal”
FFA Nov 29: “As of today, there’s a right of appeal…”
Spot on... Lord Gallop out, No More beers and DDB out....

[lquiquer]

Brilliant ...... Post match... Coach and CEO there 1219

[GazFish35]

http://nmfb01.azurewebsites.net/

Someone sorted it.

[lquiquer]

http://nmfb01.azurewebsites.net/

Someone sorted it.

Yep join in lads

[plague]

http://nmfb01.azurewebsites.net/

Someone sorted it.

So can someone tell me what the specific goal of this is?

Like, what's an outcome that would see fans happy to go back to the football?

I'm interested.

[furns]

So can someone tell me what the specific goal of this is?

Like, what's an outcome that would see fans happy to go back to the football?

I'm interested.There are two specific goals really
For the media to report on football matters in a fair and balanced manner
For the FFA to treat the supporters like stakeholders, rather than customers. This would entail defending football supporters in the face of anti-football articles and reports and to actually engage with active supporters to sort this banning process properly so that its transparent.

[furns]

Squadron launch Email & Boycott campaign


http://www.newcastlefootball.net/home/2015/11/squadron-launch-email-boycott-campaign/
We are now officially launching the email and boycott campaign we recently proposed, and its an initiative that we hope the football fraternity can join with us and get behind. The reasons behind the campaign are listed here http://www.newcastlefootball.net/home/2015/11/squadron-statement-time-to-hit-them-where-it-hurts/

We ask that you go to this website http://nmfb01.azurewebsites.net/ to fill in a form with your name and email address. This site will automatically email the daily telegraph calling for them to sack rebecca wilson and issue an apology, email 2gb to call for them to force alan jones to issue an on-air retraction and apology, and email 2gb sponsors to either pull their funding or lobby 2gb to force jones to issue an on-air retraction. Simply select the entities you wish to email, read through the statement and hit send. Its that easy.

Any show or media outlet that hosts rebecca wilson and her toxic views also needs to be emailed separately to immediately drop her as a resource. Currently the two other media outlets we know of who have used rebecca wilson recently are:
Sen radio melbourne – enquiries@sen.com.au
sky news (sports night program) –
http://www.skynews.com.au/connect/your-say.html
feel free to contact these email addresses to inform them of the current situation regarding rebecca wilson and that you will be boycotting them until she is dropped from their business.

We call on all a-league clubs to immediately blacklist news limited publications and websites (except foxsports), end any advertising or sponsorship arrangements and refuse to deal with them until such times as they remove rebecca wilson from their employ and approach future articles regarding football in a fair, balanced and researched manner.

We also call for a total boycott of news limited publications from football supporters. Dont buy their papers and dont click their links online. If we can cost them enough advertising money through decreased circulation and website clicks, they will have to change their ways to try to win the customers back they have lost.

Hopefully, with enough people sending these emails and boycotting their businesses, we will be able to force some real change and the daily telegraph, 2gb, rebecca wilson, alan jones and 2gb will remember next time to provide some balance in their reporting on football matters.

We will continue working with other supporters groups to directly lobby the ffa to come out immediately (and in future) to defend football supporters in response to anti-football media articles, for the treatment and engagement of all football supporters to improve and for the ffa to begin meeting with supporters clubs representatives to co-operatively rework the banning system to ensure procedural fairness and transparency.

We would ask that you share this article to as many football media personalities, actual journalists without anti-football agendas and your fellow football supporters as possible to spread the word and get this movement off the ground.

They will never tear us apart

squadron novocastria

[WolfMan]

Done

[Blackmac79]

Also done.

[plague]

So FFA are now going to meet supporters over the appeals issue?

Will be very very interested to see if anything gets agreed on.

Both sides seem very unwilling to give anything up. Not a good way to go about it.

[GazFish35]

cant see the FFA ever meeting. they're all talk.

I'm still waiting for the phone call about the balcony incident, one they promised to investigate and talk to all involved.



FFA PR = BS

[plague]

To be fair though, it's doesn't 'seem' like WSW were ever interested in hearing from them at the start either.

Which is weird because WSW hold the best bit of leverage out of anyone yet have the chance to use it and flatly decline.

[furns]

cant see the FFA ever meeting. they're all talk.

I'm still waiting for the phone call about the balcony incident, one they promised to investigate and talk to all involved.



FFA PR = BSthe FFA have already met with the Cove reps last week and have another meeting this week. I am hearing they may have approached rbb for a separate meeting also.

[furns]

Btw as of an hour ago, over 46000 emails had been sent via the link :thumbsup:

[Bon]

I think I've just done it.. Hit send, but then nothing changes.. Is it supposed to tell you its been sent?

Great work on this too, guys.. Well done!

[furns]

Scroll up after you hit send
It should show you what it's doing

[The Dunster]

E-mails sent.

[Thomas477]

May have clicked the send button twice, but whatever. Done.

[furns]

http://www.newcastlefootball.net/home/2015/12/squadron-statement-boycott-action-for-friday-vs-sydney-fc/

[joel31]

http://www.newcastlefootball.net/home/2015/12/squadron-statement-boycott-action-for-friday-vs-sydney-fc/
Out of interest who is still going to attend the match on Friday but not sit in active bays?

[furns]

there will probably be between 30-50 supporters going off last seasons turnout

[stopper2]

Apparently there is a meeting tomorrow for the Board of Directors at FFA Headquarters tomorrow.
Will be interesting to see if there are any new develoments. Most of the football media is onside with the supporters now, the likes of Bozza, Simon Hill, Ray Gatt, Cockerill etc and Ante Covic as Vice President of the PFA issued a statement (in the SMH) on behalf of the players backing supporters actions.
The ball is now in FFA's court, only they can resolve this now or prolong it....their choice.

[plague]

The ball is now in FFA's court, only they can resolve this now or prolong it....their choice.

nah, supporters can solve this in a heartbeat too.
you're acting like they don't have any part in this bullshit.

[Retro Jet]

Some of you who know me know I've been part of this Football odyssey as a fan for quite a long time now.
There has never been a better opportunity for fans in the history of our game here in Australia to stand up
and be counted. Watershed moment people. Be part of it...boycotts, emails (http://nmfb01.azurewebsites.net/), banners etc.

If the outcome out of all this is more power to fans, more publicity to the game and a stronger football
community...the irony of Rebecca Wilson's article being the catalyst for all this certainly won't be lost on me, because I can assure
you, she wouldn't have the best interests of the game, OUR game in mind when that article was published.
Said article filed away for posterity now...

[plague]

Some of you who know me know I've been part of this Football odyssey as a fan for quite a long time now.
There has never been a better opportunity for fans in the history of our game here in Australia to stand up
and be counted. Watershed moment people. Be part of it...boycotts, emails (http://nmfb01.azurewebsites.net/), banners etc.

If the outcome out of all this is more power to fans, more publicity to the game and a stronger football
community...the irony of Rebecca Wilson's article being the catalyst for all this certainly won't be lost on me, because I can assure
you, she wouldn't have the best interests of the game, OUR game in mind when that article was published.
Said article filed away for posterity now...

so serious question(s):
are you boycotting?
whats your desired outcome from all this?
is the match day experience as of 2 weeks ago (before the article came out) what you want?

[Retro Jet]

Some of you who know me know I've been part of this Football odyssey as a fan for quite a long time now.
There has never been a better opportunity for fans in the history of our game here in Australia to stand up
and be counted. Watershed moment people. Be part of it...boycotts, emails (http://nmfb01.azurewebsites.net/), banners etc.

If the outcome out of all this is more power to fans, more publicity to the game and a stronger football
community...the irony of Rebecca Wilson's article being the catalyst for all this certainly won't be lost on me, because I can assure
you, she wouldn't have the best interests of the game, OUR game in mind when that article was published.
Said article filed away for posterity now...


so serious question(s):
are you boycotting?
whats your desired outcome from all this?
is the match day experience as of 2 weeks ago (before the article came out) what you want?

Am I boycotting? Well, I hardly make it to away games anyway but yes, if that's the status quo with the majority of
supporters/stakeholders to make a statement? I'm in. I won't put my season ticket under the bar code scanner on match day 10 if it's dragged out that long.
Imagine the egg on FFA faces if only around 5k (or less) turned up this Friday night. Nobody in the Cove or Away end...empty bays. The silence would be deafening.
The FTA match day publicity is also an enticing opportunity to make a public statement. I can hear David Basheer now...
"The crowd have obviously voted with their feet tonight" etc. And btw, FFA couldn't blame the weather either.
http://www.bom.gov.au/nsw/forecasts/sydney.shtml

Desired outcome? Before 2 weeks ago??
Before Nov 22nd, I had no idea that some fans had been completely f***ed over by the lack of a process that never existed.
If this course of action creates change in that department, then I'm all for it. There isn't much else a fan or collective of fans can do that really
makes a statement that is heard or acknowledged. Vote with your feet...literally! I think the A-League fan base is really onto something here.
It's certainly shown the true colours of a few of those FFA pencil necks too.

I'm not that naive to think that there's quite a few turds on that list that don't belong there..because I've heard the stories from direct Boz about sh!t
Newy fans have copped...and it's a lot worse than what we copped 20+ years ago. Would I go to a Wanderers away game in the past and current
climate wearing my colours knowing my livelihood could literally be on the line because some jobless wanker with anger management issues wants to take it out on opposition
supporters? Stuff that. So, do I want a match day experience to change? Well in that department, a resounding yes.

[sammydog]

Here is my take on it the whole situation.

The Wilson article and subsequent Jones diatribe may not be a bad thing in that they have put this issue in the spotlight so it at least gets addressed. Unfortunately the way it is being addressed by the FFA and Fans is really playing into the hands of people like Wilson.

The FFA have shown themselves to be pretty weak this week. They have shown nothing in the way of leadership and their appeals process looks to be nothing more than a tick a box affair to say they have one, with no real interest in having a fair process.

While I completely agree with the fans in that there needs to be greater transparency in the banning through an appeals process, I also think some of the fans groups are responsible for this escalating to the point it has. By all accounts, things like Flare ignition make up a major part of the ban list. I'm yet to hear, or see, any group self police and remove or even publicly criticise the lighting of flares. If groups themselves aren't going to curtail their use, then yes the governing body is going to come down like a tonne of bricks.

I'll use the RBB as an example. When they travel, flares travel. We know the media loves a good story on them. Everyone knows they are illegal, but when they come to newcastle, they keep getting ripped. FFS, last season they had something making small explosive sounds (I've heard they were railway detonators but I'm not convinced). If you are going to pull stuff like this, you are going to attract increased security and policing.

Same with people in the crowd acting like dicks, throwing shit or wanting to punch on.

There are tossers in the crowds, yes they are very much the minority, but until I see some of the bigger groups making obvious moves to remove the or ostracise them, then they are also complicit in whats gone on. They are a part of what has created the crap that is going on now.

With the 198 on the list, it would be naive to think that the majority of them are squeaky clean. Thats not to take away from the fact that we need an appeals process, a fair appeals process, to make sure the process is transparent. But, to the outsider it really does look like fans are condoning the actions of all 198.

I won't be boycotting anything, I don't agree with the FFA's stance in this issue, but I don't see the groups who appear to be leading this in being squeaky clean and they as much as the FFA need to have a change in culture.

[belchardo]

well said, pretty much exactly what I think too.

[BodyNovo]

just an example off how ****ed this is and this has legitimately happened to 5-10 people;

you go to to coast away and stand in the squadron. old mate next you rips a flare and drops it. CCTV footage doesn't provide clear enough viewing and it looks you ripped the flare. you receive a 5 year ban. You immediately try to dispute it and are met with the claims that there is no appeal process.

New appeal process announced

same situation, you go to appeal your ban but you have to provide evidence to why you shouldn't be banned. unless someone near you happened to video old mate ripping the flare you have no chance. The FFA won't allow for you to see the CCTV footage and the ban will stick.

I have no doubt 140 maybe more are deservedly banned, but there are people on that list who have been banned wrongly.

so for me this boycott is for those people and future people who are banned wrongly.

[GazFish35]

for me its that bodi, but also about the limp wristed defence of the code provided by the FFA.

weve been under attack fornthe best part of the week, Gallop's response was pathetic

[BodyNovo]

for me its that bodi, but also about the limp wristed defence of the code provided by the FFA.

weve been under attack fornthe best part of the week, Gallop's response was pathetic

I was more or less going for simplistic reasons, but yes I agree 100%.

The response from Gallop was so "lawyer" like and had no passion or heart.

[plague]

you go to to coast away and stand in the squadron. old mate next you rips a flare and drops it.


So did this really happen to you or its hypothetical?

Because why didn't you just tell them exactly who lit the flare if they are standing right next to you?

[sammydog]

I agree, in that scenario, thats wrong and there should be an appeals process. The FFA should also make available any evidence they have that was used to hand out the ban. If its good enough to ban people with, its strong enough to hold up to scrutiny.

But in the same situation, where is the leaders of whatever supporters groupie is outing the dickhead that ripped the flare, the same dickhead who is ****ing careless with it and drops it not giving a flying **** who gets burnt while its on the ground. the same dickhead who doesn't care that someone else copped a ban for their actions. This is where it all falls over.

I've heard the argument before, don't dob in your mates. But the tool who caused the issue doesn't cop a ban while some innocent person takes the flack. If they don't care about the impacts of their actions on the people around them, why should the people around them care about him.

Everyone feels sorry for the people wrongly evicted and banned, as we should, but no one is condemning and outing the very people that created the situation. Its a self perpetuating problem (granted, given the numbers it is minor in scale) and the supporters groups as much FFA and security have a role to play. Respect is a two way street.

[GazFish35]

Sammydog, no one at any level is suggesting the 198 are squeaky clean.

Everything I've read from all levels of the issue admit there's a problem.

The only thing making this look like boycotts to support ALL the 198 is lazy journos who haven't looked into the issue simplifying for an easy sound bite or headline.


I agree more needs to be done by bigger groups (especially the rbb) to weed out their trouble, and denounce flares, but a active Groups lack of leadership on this particular issue shouldn't excuse innocent folk from being banned, and then not able to see the evidence against them.


Agreed is a case for the rbb at least of wanting to have the cake and eat it too.

[plague]

for me its that bodi, but also about the limp wristed defence of the code provided by the FFA.

weve been under attack fornthe best part of the week, Gallop's response was pathetic

I'm interested in this 'lack of leadership' (commonly used words not yours directly Mr Fish) regarding the FFA.

To me they are providing leadership by saying "screw the >1% who are mucking up we are only concerned with the 99% who want to go and enjoy a safe night at the football".
To me that's leadership.

You want them to reply to every article regarding your constituents? Jeez then do you expect the same from unions/business/religious groups everytime the Tele goes looking for a fight? The poor Muslims would go hoarse!!!

Also it is a bit of a furphy regarding the appeals process. I'm sure Mr Furns has said that bans have been overturned for Jets fans after consultation with the club (please correct if wrong).

It is probably no coincidence that a healthy relationship between fans/club and FFA have helped Jets fans have those bans overturned.

Am I shocked that (in the case of the WSW) that the FFA aren't as helpful when all some of those fans have done is thumb their nose at any attempts to curtail a few elements of their behaviour.

Again, the aggrieved fans can fix this in a second. They just don't seem to want to.

[plague]

The only thing making this look like boycotts to support ALL the 198 is lazy journos who haven't looked into the issue simplifying for an easy sound bite or headline.


Didn't the Cove have a sign saying something like "we stand with the 198"? Or was that a lazy journo?

[WolfMan]

RE : self policing - the squadron have pointed out and helped apprehend a blow in that ripped a flare in Bay 2 a few seasons back.

The same thing would happen if somebody did something stupid in Bay 60 these days.

That reminds me - why did SD get dragged last week? Too much red cordial?

[plague]

RE : self policing - the squadron have pointed out and helped apprehend a blow in that ripped a flare in Bay 2 a few seasons back.

The same thing would happen if somebody did something stupid in Bay 60 these days.


And if that was the attitude across all clubs we wouldn't be in this pickle.

It's a simple fix.
Squadron ahead of the curve.

[sammydog]

The banner I didn't like was the "FFA Don't bury your heads the sand, we've listed our demands".

That screams of a group that isn't there to negotiate a thing, a group that doesn't see that they have at all contributed to any of the mess we have right now, a group that sees themselves as bigger than the sport and able to dictate its terms.

The Wilson article was never aimed at your Squadron, Yellow army, Den, etc. It was always squarely at the bigger groups like the RBB, NT and The Cove. No doubt the majority of the supported in these groups aren't an issue, never have been, never will be. Its eliminating the dickhead element that they have a role to play. Ive seen nothing to indicate there is a desire to do so.

The real answer to the current issue is in the middle ground. As much as the FFA need to get their house in order in terms of the banning and appeals process, the various active support have a role to play in outing the dickhead element. This doesn't have to be passing them off to authorities, but just not making them welcome in the first place.

[Nou Camp]

what have individual supporter groups done to eliminate the dickhead element from their own groups?

[plague]

what have individual supporter groups done to eliminate the dickhead element from their own groups?

Nah mate, it's these strangers who no one knows who manage to get right into the middle of the group and let flares off then disappear in a cloud of ninja dust then brag about it on social media but they are strangers and no one knows them and it's not our fault and all cops are bastards and not our fault and we would honestly stop it of we could but strangers just keep popping up it's uncanny did I mention all cops are bastards?

[belchardo]

david squires take on the silliness

http://www.theguardian.com/sport/picture/2015/dec/03/david-squires-on-the-response-to-a-league-fan-protests

[GazFish35]

Didn't the Cove have a sign saying something like "we stand with the 198"? Or was that a lazy journo?

they stand with the 198 not being named and shamed in the paper - they didn't boycott for them.

the boycotts are about a lack of appeals process, and not speaking out strongly enough against the slander the code has copped.



I saw and heard four reports this morning saying "a-league fans boycotting games this weekend to show support for 198 trouble makers"
that is what I call lazy journalism

[Jeterpool]

Lowy and Gallop holding another presser at 2:00

[GazFish35]

I'm interested in this 'lack of leadership' (commonly used words not yours directly Mr Fish) regarding the FFA.

To me they are providing leadership by saying "screw the >1% who are mucking up we are only concerned with the 99% who want to go and enjoy a safe night at the football".
To me that's leadership.

You want them to reply to every article regarding your constituents? Jeez then do you expect the same from unions/business/religious groups everytime the Tele goes looking for a fight? The poor Muslims would go hoarse!!!

Also it is a bit of a furphy regarding the appeals process. I'm sure Mr Furns has said that bans have been overturned for Jets fans after consultation with the club (please correct if wrong).

It is probably no coincidence that a healthy relationship between fans/club and FFA have helped Jets fans have those bans overturned.

Am I shocked that (in the case of the WSW) that the FFA aren't as helpful when all some of those fans have done is thumb their nose at any attempts to curtail a few elements of their behaviour.

Again, the aggrieved fans can fix this in a second. They just don't seem to want to.



I agree the groups with bigger trouble maker elements need to do more.


leadership - see the CEO of Victory's speech last night. - http://www.melbournevictory.com.au/article/victory-in-business-luncheon-delivers-again/4qjo9pz5qje9161v9ccu93ycq from 5:48

I don't expect Gallop to defend the code form every jibe in the media, but Wilson's article, Jones' 2cents and even Sam Newman FFS has created a situation where the code needed its leaders to stand up to it. Fans have been likened to terrorists - if that isn't worthy of the head of the code speaking out, I don't know what would - its insanely disrespectful to the victims in Paris if nothing else.

[joel31]

Here is my take on it the whole situation.

The Wilson article and subsequent Jones diatribe may not be a bad thing in that they have put this issue in the spotlight so it at least gets addressed. Unfortunately the way it is being addressed by the FFA and Fans is really playing into the hands of people like Wilson.

The FFA have shown themselves to be pretty weak this week. They have shown nothing in the way of leadership and their appeals process looks to be nothing more than a tick a box affair to say they have one, with no real interest in having a fair process.

While I completely agree with the fans in that there needs to be greater transparency in the banning through an appeals process, I also think some of the fans groups are responsible for this escalating to the point it has. By all accounts, things like Flare ignition make up a major part of the ban list. I'm yet to hear, or see, any group self police and remove or even publicly criticise the lighting of flares. If groups themselves aren't going to curtail their use, then yes the governing body is going to come down like a tonne of bricks.

I'll use the RBB as an example. When they travel, flares travel. We know the media loves a good story on them. Everyone knows they are illegal, but when they come to newcastle, they keep getting ripped. FFS, last season they had something making small explosive sounds (I've heard they were railway detonators but I'm not convinced). If you are going to pull stuff like this, you are going to attract increased security and policing.

Same with people in the crowd acting like dicks, throwing shit or wanting to punch on.

There are tossers in the crowds, yes they are very much the minority, but until I see some of the bigger groups making obvious moves to remove the or ostracise them, then they are also complicit in whats gone on. They are a part of what has created the crap that is going on now.

With the 198 on the list, it would be naive to think that the majority of them are squeaky clean. Thats not to take away from the fact that we need an appeals process, a fair appeals process, to make sure the process is transparent. But, to the outsider it really does look like fans are condoning the actions of all 198.

I won't be boycotting anything, I don't agree with the FFA's stance in this issue, but I don't see the groups who appear to be leading this in being squeaky clean and they as much as the FFA need to have a change in culture.
Agree 100%

[Jeterpool]

2:00pm Presser with Lowy and Gallop

[plague]

I agree the groups with bigger trouble maker elements need to do more.


See this is the classic handwringing nimby attitude that got us here.

EVERYONE is out there saying "we need to do more" but the second someone does something you guys are like 'whoa whoa whoa, not THAT'.

Well what's your solution?
How you going to stop flares?
How you going to stop violence?
How are you going to get to a place where riot cops aren't needed to walk fans to, and babysit them in, the stadium?

Because the second this stuff affects the general public they are gonna sue the FFA, not you, not the perpetrators, not the players and not the active groups.
They will go after the FFA and the same people calling for 'someone to do something' will be screaming 'DUTY OF CARE'!!!

[hawk]

If anyone was serious in kicking the FFA in the ass they would be organising a rebel competition.


How would you get A-League players who would be putting their careers on the line to join?

Good point big J. There wouldnt be a need.

This is the show boat comp to get the punters in that will destroy the other league.

There would be any hollywood type recruited, any name who played in the last 30yrs at top level, a whole bunch of kids who keep getting pushed out by the other communist league clubs, kits that are striking and cant help but leave the shelves, then there would be fan incentives - cheap tix, dancing girls/boys, a tough boy flare section, cheap beer from local breweries, food at fishnchip shop prices, low security on banners and inflatables, school competitions (GAz is already in), low cost free to air, paytv and streaming. players will visit home for fifa nites and bbq's pleasing whole towns and cities.

writes itself

[plague]

Good point big J. There wouldnt be a need.

This is the show boat comp to get the punters in that will destroy the other league.

There would be any hollywood type recruited, any name who played in the last 30yrs at top level, a whole bunch of kids who keep getting pushed out by the other communist league clubs, kits that are striking and cant help but leave the shelves, then there would be fan incentives - cheap tix, dancing girls/boys, a tough boy flare section, cheap beer from local breweries, food at fishnchip shop prices, low security on banners and inflatables, school competitions (GAz is already in), low cost free to air, paytv and streaming. players will visit home for fifa nites and bbq's pleasing whole towns and cities.

writes itself

No mention of swimming pools?

Sorry but I can't be part of this.

[GazFish35]

See this is the classic handwringing nimby attitude that got us here.

EVERYONE is out there saying "we need to do more" but the second someone does something you guys are like 'whoa whoa whoa, not THAT'.

Well what's your solution?
How you going to stop flares?
How you going to stop violence?
How are you going to get to a place where riot cops aren't needed to walk fans to, and babysit them in, the stadium?

Because the second this stuff affects the general public they are gonna sue the FFA, not you, not the perpetrators, not the players and not the active groups.
They will go after the FFA and the same people calling for 'someone to do something' will be screaming 'DUTY OF CARE'!!!


Nimby? Can you explain what that means?

Groups need to make staremt against flare use.
They need to stop glorifying their use on social media.
They need to stop being anti-authoritarian for the sake of it.
They need to hand over repeated perpetrators.

At the same time the FFA's zero tolerance needs to continue, but security and policing need to happen in a manner that doesn't escalate issues, like marching into bays wielding batons as I've seen at the sfs when victory played sfc, or pepper spraying with abandon in the rbb... Close bays if they have, tell the rbb to sort there shit or the north hill gets closed.

While those two things need to happen, and appeal process for when authorities get it wrong needs to be in place so fans wrongly accused can get off, that process needs to be clear and transparent and easy for the innocent, not the 6-8 months of hard slog, endless kangaroo court negotiations and false promises to end up with a clear error being reversed.

Nothing nimby about it. Whatever nimby means.


Starting to think you're just trying stir the pot plague and not realizing nearly everyone commenting in support of the active fans protest actions fully recognize the issues that exist. No one has there head in the sand in regards to denying some fans deserve their bans and groups need to self police more effectively.

I for one want this appeals process to exist so the real dickheads causing real trouble can no longer hide behind the "I get no right to appeal" argument. Let them appeal, let the appeal be open and transparent, let everyone see what they're accused of, and an explanation of why. Then let them rot when they can no longer deny they weren't afforded an appeal. The appeals process at the every least cleans that list from 198 to a lesser number and then we all know that 160 (random number) are genuinely deserving of their ban and aren't welcome in the code.


I've heard some argue, "don't do anything wrong and you've got nothing to worry about" and that's the exact situation we are in. People who have done nothing wrong are currently banned, they should have had nothing to worry about.

Hell I've seen blokes get dragged out by seccos and the secco is yelling at him about shit done at nightclubs in town months ago. We've got 198 currently banned, and we're all labeled thugs and terrorists, while Cricket evict 190+ in one day and police report the crowd as well behaved?

Balance in reporting and managing football crowds is needed. An appeals process is pivotal in that.

[Jeterpool]

Reading the Press Conference on twitter, it sounded like they said today what they should have said 10 days ago. However, it sounded to me like a much stronger performance but is it too little too late?

[plague]

Starting to think you're just trying stir the pot plague


Actually (at least this time) I'm not. Am always happy to discuss these things and whilst ever I get concise measured replies like yours I will continue (so cheers for that).
Whether we agree or not isn't as important as getting our points across in a civil manner.

The thing is though that we pretty much agree in the outcomes everyone is striving for.
It's the process of getting there that we have differing opinions on.

Your points regarding what supporter groups should be doing is spot on. But they aren't doing that are they. At the very least they are saying 'we don't condone violence in any way.......BUT' and we all know that nothing good comes after the word 'but'.

I just cringe at everyone bemoaning the lack of leadership when the FFA are the only ones taking any real action at all.

If RBB came out and said, hey we'll get rid of the flares if you get rid of the riot police I bet the situation would solve itself quicker that the current process.

As for the Victory isn't it a bit rich coming from them after they essentially went through this with the NT over the past few seasons? Especially when it looks like the club won that argument by not giving into their bullshit actions. The issues were resolved through discussion weren't they but is it any coincidence that flares are no longer a mainstay at MV games?

For some reason I found myself at several MV games at Etihad that season where the NT was up the back and there wasn't a flare in any of them. Do they still bring them to Jets games I do t know because I hate the Jets?

I have other thoughts on the Alan Jones thing but need to do some reading first. Will get to that hypocrite later.


Tl;dr?

Griff is the only one who can save us.
Hail Griff.

[plague]

Oh and when I refer to a nimby attitude just imagine how Sarah Hansen-Young lives her life then you'll be close.

[GazFish35]

The issues were resolved through discussion weren't they

and that in part where what the walkouts were about, trying to be heard as discussions weren't forthcoming, that message was missed, so the threat of boycotting was used.

I hope after today's press conference things might temper and groups get back to the stands.

Gallop and Lowy Jnr today were far far better than the previous two weeks of contradictory and pissweak answers.

[Thomas477]

I stand with Plague.

Hail Griff!

[The Dunster]

I feel sorry for any khunt on here who didn't grow up in the 1960's and early 1970's - you have absolutely no idea how great this country once was.
Back then you could kick a ball around at half time at a VFL / AFL match. You could jump the fence at games end and mob your favourite players while they headed towards the change rooms for the standard post game beer and cigarette.

When you went to the cricket and could take in as many ESKYS full of beer you liked. When chicks would regularly get their gear off and run onto the field in an attempt to launch a modelling career .... and so on.

As for security ? What the **** is that ? It didn't exist. it didn't have to because people back then had a strong sense of community and looked out for each other.

These days it's the neo-liberalist politically correct bullshit being injected into peoples minds that's ****ing things up.

Could you image ten year olds walking down the main street of any Newcastle or Lake Macquarie suburb these days carrying Slug Guns or arm mounted slingshots ? Back in the 60's and 70's it happened all the time. You would carry your slug gun into the local newsagent to buy your .22 or .17 Winchester slugs ffs. Occasionally an adult would say something like you boys be careful - but usually people didn't say a word because kids back then looked after each other much like adults did around them.

Sure there were bad eggs back then but not even remotely close to the shit going down these days.

**** regulation - it simply does not work.

[q-money]

dunster the voice of bloody reason as usual :wub:

[hawk]

No mention of swimming pools?

Sorry but I can't be part of this.

inflatables cover this

[Jetmaster]

dunster the voice of bloody reason as usual :wub:

And he's right...we are over policed now. Everytime something nasty happens there are new laws. Culture is just reacting to it.

[hawk]

Oh and when I refer to a nimby attitude just imagine how Sarah Hansen-Young lives her life then you'll be close.

that fraud SHY is that "Jarmay" from Chris lilly fame. Full of pretentious turd. there are yr6 girls who have more nous

[hawk]

dont get me started on retarded secos who target people who have not done any wrong. Same turds let wsw fans waltz into the active.

[lquiquer]

Gallop constant talk of flares irritates me as much of abbott's ****ing favourite sentence: "We stopped the boat people"....

[plague]

inflatables cover this

Ok I'm in


Just one caveat though, can the team be named after some sort of impressive machine/engineering feat/weapon of war cause that flyover was boss last weekend and we need more of that sort of nonsense please.

Thanks Hawk.

[plague]

Gallop constant talk of flares irritates me

I'd dare say he's sick of it too.

One way to fix it though innit?

[belchardo]

Ok I'm in


Just one caveat though, can the team be named after some sort of impressive machine/engineering feat/weapon of war cause that flyover was boss last weekend and we need more of that sort of nonsense please.

Thanks Hawk.

Newcastle supertankers. Imagine one of them coming up the drain.

[Wilso8948]

Me and a mate heading down on the train Tomoz. Gonna be blind rotten drunk. Are we gonna be the only khunts there or whaaat? Who do we write to when we get dragged for spitting on seb ryall?

[cymonster]

I'm still going down and gonna be in the away bay. Don't really like boycotting games

[hawk]

if i wasnt going down to the game and i am boycotting that i suppose i should go

[joel31]

I will be there but won't be in away bay

[Blackmac79]

Those going, I encourage you to sit elsewhere in the ground other than the away bay.

[sammydog]

I'd dare say he's sick of it too.

One way to fix it though innit?

Almost seems to simple a solution.

[GazFish35]

What timeline are boycotting groups expecting for FFA to implement the requested appeals process?

To be done to a standard even remotely close to an acceptable manner, February doesn't seem an unreadable time frame.

Consult with all fan groups, consult with Police from 5 states, tell hatamoto to **** off, work through legal implications, Formalise a plan, review it all, then table to to FFA board.

I get its all been empty promises and talk for so long, and after gallops first press conference this week he gave little detail or indication they'd listed to the messages from last weekend, but the Lowy/gallop press conference did a number of things - denounced the media coverage of this issue, admitted they got it wrong, explained some of the complexities surrounding confidentiality of evidence, and most importantly imposed a realistic timeline on themselves to come back with an answer.

Boycotting IMO wreaks of the rbb and NT and to lesser extent the cove trying to flex their muscle with the FFA and score another point in a fight they won last week.

Demanding a system be implemented immediately is unrealistic and boycotting because of it actually makes the active fan collective look petulant and unreasonable. Push too hard when the FFA have just given an indicator (the strongest one yet) that they are open to addressing the issue and you lose the support of the other fans..... And that's where this argument will be won.

The message of "we want a fair process" is being lost on the masses because the FFA have made a reasonable timeline public and the protests have only escalated.
The message of "they've had 11 years to fix it" doesn't wash either - we all know they've done nothing in that time, some Actives even argue that this 11 years of no action is a reason behind the protests. So an acknowledgement that they've done nothing for 11 years makes the demand of an instant implementation of a complex system even more unreasonable.
Take up an unreasonable position and ground will be lost.

Boycotts should have been called off IMO.

Boycotts can not continue beyond the week and I hope when in discussions with other groups about next week a more reasoned approach is promoted.

Again I understand the "it's all been empty promises in the past" argument, but if that's the reasoning behind the boycott then that position needs to be held till February at a minimum and by then active support will self implode if it doesn't already drown in a sea of negative media.

The Big picture is no longer about needing the FFA to implement a fair process (to the average joe, that ball is already rolling), it's now about active fans being seen as reasonable people with reasonable demands.

[leftrightout]

What timeline are boycotting groups expecting for FFA to implement the requested appeals process?

To be done to a standard even remotely close to an acceptable manner, February doesn't seem an unreadable time frame.

Consult with all fan groups, consult with Police from 5 states, tell hatamoto to **** off, work through legal implications, Formalise a plan, review it all, then table to to FFA board.

I get its all been empty promises and talk for so long, and after gallops first press conference this week he gave little detail or indication they'd listed to the messages from last weekend, but the Lowy/gallop press conference did a number of things - denounced the media coverage of this issue, admitted they got it wrong, explained some of the complexities surrounding confidentiality of evidence, and most importantly imposed a realistic timeline on themselves to come back with an answer.

Boycotting IMO wreaks of the rbb and NT and to lesser extent the cove trying to flex their muscle with the FFA and score another point in a fight they won last week.

Demanding a system be implemented immediately is unrealistic and boycotting because of it actually makes the active fan collective look petulant and unreasonable. Push too hard when the FFA have just given an indicator (the strongest one yet) that they are open to addressing the issue and you lose the support of the other fans..... And that's where this argument will be won.

The message of "we want a fair process" is being lost on the masses because the FFA have made a reasonable timeline public and the protests have only escalated.
The message of "they've had 11 years to fix it" doesn't wash either - we all know they've done nothing in that time, some Actives even argue that this 11 years of no action is a reason behind the protests. So an acknowledgement that they've done nothing for 11 years makes the demand of an instant implementation of a complex system even more unreasonable.
Take up an unreasonable position and ground will be lost.

Boycotts should have been called off IMO.

Boycotts can not continue beyond the week and I hope when in discussions with other groups about next week a more reasoned approach is promoted.

Again I understand the "it's all been empty promises in the past" argument, but if that's the reasoning behind the boycott then that position needs to be held till February at a minimum and by then active support will self implode if it doesn't already drown in a sea of negative media.

The Big picture is no longer about needing the FFA to implement a fair process (to the average joe, that ball is already rolling), it's now about active fans being seen as reasonable people with reasonable demands.

Well said, i have to agree with this.

[Jetmaster]

Well said, i have to agree with this.

Ditto...it isn't something can can just be done in 24 hours.

[sammydog]

What timeline are boycotting groups expecting for FFA to implement the requested appeals process?

To be done to a standard even remotely close to an acceptable manner, February doesn't seem an unreadable time frame.

Consult with all fan groups, consult with Police from 5 states, tell hatamoto to **** off, work through legal implications, Formalise a plan, review it all, then table to to FFA board.

I get its all been empty promises and talk for so long, and after gallops first press conference this week he gave little detail or indication they'd listed to the messages from last weekend, but the Lowy/gallop press conference did a number of things - denounced the media coverage of this issue, admitted they got it wrong, explained some of the complexities surrounding confidentiality of evidence, and most importantly imposed a realistic timeline on themselves to come back with an answer.

Boycotting IMO wreaks of the rbb and NT and to lesser extent the cove trying to flex their muscle with the FFA and score another point in a fight they won last week.

Demanding a system be implemented immediately is unrealistic and boycotting because of it actually makes the active fan collective look petulant and unreasonable. Push too hard when the FFA have just given an indicator (the strongest one yet) that they are open to addressing the issue and you lose the support of the other fans..... And that's where this argument will be won.

The message of "we want a fair process" is being lost on the masses because the FFA have made a reasonable timeline public and the protests have only escalated.
The message of "they've had 11 years to fix it" doesn't wash either - we all know they've done nothing in that time, some Actives even argue that this 11 years of no action is a reason behind the protests. So an acknowledgement that they've done nothing for 11 years makes the demand of an instant implementation of a complex system even more unreasonable.
Take up an unreasonable position and ground will be lost.

Boycotts should have been called off IMO.

Boycotts can not continue beyond the week and I hope when in discussions with other groups about next week a more reasoned approach is promoted.

Again I understand the "it's all been empty promises in the past" argument, but if that's the reasoning behind the boycott then that position needs to be held till February at a minimum and by then active support will self implode if it doesn't already drown in a sea of negative media.

The Big picture is no longer about needing the FFA to implement a fair process (to the average joe, that ball is already rolling), it's now about active fans being seen as reasonable people with reasonable demands.

Bang on the money with this one.

The way it pans out from here will largely show the true colours of the likes of the RBB and NT and whether they see themselves as above the game. Their action from here could actually do more damage, but given none of them seem to even loosely acknowledge that they have been part of the problem that got us here, I won't hold my breath.

[MFKS]

What timeline are boycotting groups expecting for FFA to implement the requested appeals process?

To be done to a standard even remotely close to an acceptable manner, February doesn't seem an unreadable time frame.

Consult with all fan groups, consult with Police from 5 states, tell hatamoto to **** off, work through legal implications, Formalise a plan, review it all, then table to to FFA board.

I get its all been empty promises and talk for so long, and after gallops first press conference this week he gave little detail or indication they'd listed to the messages from last weekend, but the Lowy/gallop press conference did a number of things - denounced the media coverage of this issue, admitted they got it wrong, explained some of the complexities surrounding confidentiality of evidence, and most importantly imposed a realistic timeline on themselves to come back with an answer.

Boycotting IMO wreaks of the rbb and NT and to lesser extent the cove trying to flex their muscle with the FFA and score another point in a fight they won last week.

Demanding a system be implemented immediately is unrealistic and boycotting because of it actually makes the active fan collective look petulant and unreasonable. Push too hard when the FFA have just given an indicator (the strongest one yet) that they are open to addressing the issue and you lose the support of the other fans..... And that's where this argument will be won.

The message of "we want a fair process" is being lost on the masses because the FFA have made a reasonable timeline public and the protests have only escalated.
The message of "they've had 11 years to fix it" doesn't wash either - we all know they've done nothing in that time, some Actives even argue that this 11 years of no action is a reason behind the protests. So an acknowledgement that they've done nothing for 11 years makes the demand of an instant implementation of a complex system even more unreasonable.
Take up an unreasonable position and ground will be lost.

Boycotts should have been called off IMO.

Boycotts can not continue beyond the week and I hope when in discussions with other groups about next week a more reasoned approach is promoted.

Again I understand the "it's all been empty promises in the past" argument, but if that's the reasoning behind the boycott then that position needs to be held till February at a minimum and by then active support will self implode if it doesn't already drown in a sea of negative media.

The Big picture is no longer about needing the FFA to implement a fair process (to the average joe, that ball is already rolling), it's now about active fans being seen as reasonable people with reasonable demands.

Exactly what is the need to protest for???
That banner last week about standing behind the 198 means **** all to me

The vast majority that are in the 198 I don't want to support as they deserve to be there in the first place.

NT Cove and RBB just losing what little credibility they have more and more every week by carrying on like flogs

They are the ones making it out to be all about them.

Yes we need an appeals process but Plague is bang on the money with a lot of what he has said

The FFA are not the big problem here. It is the flogs out there that support our game and carry on like dickheads over being pulled up for being dickheads that are causing the problem.


Protest and walk out because the FFA have banned 198 people because the vast majority are dickheads.
No doubt some are unfairly treated but spare me the bullshit that this is the issue.

The issue is dickheads want to be treated better for being dickheads and all of a sudden a mass of gullible people are falling into line to support them

As for Rebecca Wilson and Alan Jones both are ****wits of the highest order
The pedo and drink driving stuff and bringing that up just makes football fans look like halfwits themselves

Both are easily dealt with as their opinions are as hollow uneducated and delusional it isn't funny.


Football fans really need to stick to playing the ball on this issue as they are too busy playing the man

[parksey]

make it stop

[plague]

make it stop

This thread?
Nah man, it's up there with the politics thread.
Especially now that the Member has turned up.
Game on moles.

[furns]

Just to clarify for ppl who are wondering why the supporters groups across the league are continuing the boycott action, please have a listen to this podcast via the link for the reasons as explained by Grant Muir

https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=839246532840801&id=465944306837694

[GazFish35]

clear as mud Furns. TBH

I'm trying my best to make sense of it, more than most would I reckon.

I still can't see how boycotting fans can say they acknowledge the complexities in resolving the appeals process but still expect it all to be sorted in a consultative manner before the timeframe the FFA have announced.

"We want action, not words" is a great catchphrase and I agree the FFA's words have little credibility, but demanding action so swiftly is unrealistic and weakens the position of the protests, because "average joe" fans wont continue to support the actives if they perceive the demands to be unrealistic.



AND... at least put an explicit and realistic timeframe to the FFA. asking the FFA to be "more urgent" allows them to say "we'll do it ASAP", its a bad as DeBohun saying they'll look at it in the near future, or they'll announce something soon.



put up a realistic expectation and pitch the battle over that, not on unrealistic terms....otherwise goodwill will fade quicker than Arsenal title hope now the Sanchez is cooked.

[furns]

There are things still being worked on behind the scenes Gaz, hopefully in the next couple of days as part of the collective we will be able to publicise them.
Be assured its not all groups saying "We are protesting until you immediately announce a new banning procedure", but its worth remembering that most groups across the league have tried in vain on multiple occasions over many years to engage with the FFA on the banning process and the role of Hatamoto and have been fobbed off at every turn.
Its taken the unprecedented action of all groups presenting a united front to even get them to admit the process needs to be reworked.

[GazFish35]

I understand this has been coming to a head for a long time.

What I'm worried about is the damage done to the code and active support by taking an unreasonable position in terms of the timeframe demanded.


Due to the coordinated protests last week the issues are now becoming more commonly known and far more could have been gained by being seen to take the FFA up on their timeline of early February, then relaunching protests if nothing comes to fruition.

This will be won or lost by whoever the general masses side with, and to keep them as onside as possible reasonable positions need to be taken - as mush as I'm aware these issues have been breeding for years, the vast majority of fans wouldn't have a clue and don't really care.

The media will spin this however best suits them, we know that. Taking a reasonable position takes the media heat away from it all and as the objective of having the FFA admit there's an issue and place a timeline on change has happened, retreat (for lack of a better word) engage in the process the FFA undertake and if the FFA fail to meet their own timeline go in hard again, with another coordinated round of protests.

Push too hard now, and the goodwill of the masses will side with the FFA.

[plague]

but its worth remembering that most groups across the league have tried in vain on multiple occasions over many years to engage with the FFA on the banning process and the role of Hatamoto and have been fobbed off at every turn.


it should also be noted that the FFA has tried in vain multiple times to stop fans ripping flares at games and have been fobbed off at every turn

[hawk]

it should also be noted that the FFA has tried in vain multiple times to stop fans ripping flares at games and have been fobbed off at every turn

wog heros mate

[plague]

wog heros mate

Hashtagkulture

[snake]

double eff-aye have been treating the real fans like shit for years.

real fans - as in single males 18-35. this is the core, not your whoosbag familias with their baseball caps, flags, seats on half-way, carton of chips and a coke zero.

agree with dunster from a few pages back. this country has gone to shit, and the rate of shittening is accelerating at an alarming rate. a whole stadium of mid-strength at $7 a pop ffs. bring back fight-brau you weak cunce!

[q-money]

double eff-aye have been treating the real fans like shit for years.

real fans - as in single males 18-35. this is the core, not your whoosbag familias with their baseball caps, flags, seats on half-way, carton of chips and a coke zero.

agree with dunster from a few pages back. this country has gone to shit, and the rate of shittening is accelerating at an alarming rate. a whole stadium of mid-strength at $7 a pop ffs. bring back fight-brau you weak cunce!

preach it

adelaide oval, full strength piss all day, didn't rape anyone, didn't kill anyone had a damn good time. would have taken my 22 if they let me the pricks

[snake]

preach it

adelaide oval, full strength piss all day, didn't rape anyone, didn't kill anyone had a damn good time. would have taken my 22 if they let me the pricks

town hall last night. real pub, lotsa dank, good local, retro-fitted electricity etc. not your fancy pants, wifi, water features, meal buzzers and air-conditioning nonsense. even they are full of aids past 10pm. one beer per person per transaction ffs. ****ing internet generation

[furns]

it should also be noted that the FFA has tried in vain multiple times to stop fans ripping flares at games and have been fobbed off at every turnfor those who refuse to pay attention I repeat - people who have been rightly banned for flares and violence are not the reason for the groups current stance regarding the banning process.

[sammydog]

for those who refuse to pay attention I repeat - people who have been rightly banned for flares and violence are not the reason for the groups current stance regarding the banning process.

We all know that, but ask the general punter and they think it looks like the boycotts are for the 198.

I completely agree the banning process and lack of transparency in any appeals process needs to change, but none of the groups like the RBB will acknowledge that they have and continue to fuel the over policing and regulation of their active groups. The RBB could easily curtail flares and antisocial behaviour in the bays which would account for a large portion of the bannings, but they don't. All you see is an anti-establishment view of the world that they have been harshly dealt with with no consideration of how they add to the issue.

So until groups look to clean up their act, and acknowledge that like the FFA, they too have an issue, a lot of punters will continue to think that the boycotts are related to all 198. Take away the flares and a large portion of the banning, right or wrongly given, go away.

Call it sloppy reporting or whatever. We all know the media in this country well enough to know that outside of the small football media, the actual message will be lost.

[plague]

for those who refuse to pay attention I repeat - people who have been rightly banned for flares and violence are not the reason for the groups current stance regarding the banning process.

Nah man.
The article came out and the shitstorm started.
The banning process was in place before the article yet everyone was cool cool and still happy to go watch their team.
The narrative changed once the shitstorm started that it was now about the appeals process.
Whilst ever everyone keeps blaming everyone else instead of the morons punching in and ripping flares the longer we'll be here roaming round in circles like Caravella.

[The Dunster]

http://www.openjournal.com.au/wp-content/uploads/sites/62/2014/04/SCG-The-Hill-1982_LR.jpg

:wub:

This is 1982 see if you can spot the seccos or boutique cats piss beer in plastic cups..

[plague]

double eff-aye have been treating the real fans like shit for years.

real fans - as in single males 18-35.

Dana White is more than happy to take their cash.

[Jetmaster]

http://www.openjournal.com.au/wp-content/uploads/sites/62/2014/04/SCG-The-Hill-1982_LR.jpg

:wub:

This is 1982 see if you can spot the seccos or boutique cats piss beer in plastic cups..

Great pic...what days! Saw more tits on that hill than at Pink Pussycat, saw mates have sex under rugs and once watched a guy devour a foam esky with his 12 beers and pound of prawns.

Funny as shit, no cops, no seccos and nobody got hurt.

[GazFish35]

for those who refuse to pay attention I repeat - people who have been rightly banned for flares and violence are not the reason for the groups current stance regarding the banning process.

I'm paying attention.
So is plague.

The reason there's an unjust banning process is because groups refuse to self police.
If the next time a flare is lit in the rbb the bloke is frog marched out of there by other fans this whole issue goes away.
Get the groups to stop glorifying flare use on social media and attracting attention to the dick heads and shit starts going away.

If the argument truly is about wanting the FFA to do something about the innocent, active groups are gonna have to start doing something about the guilty so that the line between the two is easier to distinguish.

[plague]

If the argument truly is about wanting the FFA to do something about the innocent, active groups are gonna have to start doing something about the guilty so that the line between the two is easier to distinguish.

This is an excellent group of words.

[sammydog]

I'm paying attention.
So is plague.

The reason there's an unjust banning process is because groups refuse to self police.
If the next time a flare is lit in the rbb the bloke is frog marched out of there by other fans this whole issue goes away.
Get the groups to stop glorifying flare use on social media and attracting attention to the dick heads and shit starts going away.

If the argument truly is about wanting the FFA to do something about the innocent, active groups are gonna have to start doing something about the guilty so that the line between the two is easier to distinguish.

Nail.....head.

End of the discussion right there.

[380]

I'm paying attention.
So is plague.

The reason there's an unjust banning process is because groups refuse to self police.
If the next time a flare is lit in the rbb the bloke is frog marched out of there by other fans this whole issue goes away.
Get the groups to stop glorifying flare use on social media and attracting attention to the dick heads and shit starts going away.

If the argument truly is about wanting the FFA to do something about the innocent, active groups are gonna have to start doing something about the guilty so that the line between the two is easier to distinguish.

Nailed it Hammer Man.

[furns]

I'm paying attention.
So is plague.

The reason there's an unjust banning process is because groups refuse to self police.
If the next time a flare is lit in the rbb the bloke is frog marched out of there by other fans this whole issue goes away.
Get the groups to stop glorifying flare use on social media and attracting attention to the dick heads and shit starts going away.

If the argument truly is about wanting the FFA to do something about the innocent, active groups are gonna have to start doing something about the guilty so that the line between the two is easier to distinguish.
We can't do anything about how the rbb and NTC police their own members. However is worth noting that all the other groups do self police and have much less or none (as in the squadrons case) of these issues.

[hawk]

Theres a few issues running here.

Nearly all those cvnts banned deserve it and are from the big 3 and thus who are running this boycott stuff. In some cases they want some their buff twat mates to get off, a couple are supposedly innocent and deserve a hearing.

For us and all clubs we are concerned about if someone falls over a fence in celebration, or if someones beer ends up in the wrong place, or if someone god forbid stands on a seat we have a chance to explain what it was and receive a just consequence.

[hawk]

what a joke about self policing in the rbb. why would they be bothered to do that. the leaders are cvnts also

[plague]

We can't do anything about how the rbb and NTC police their own members. However is worth noting that all the other groups do self police and have much less or none (as in the squadrons case) of these issues.
Agree 100% you can't police the RBB etc but by standing with them to some it looks like you are supporting their behaviour.
you just gave the answer to how the RBB can solve this issue. If 7/8 clubs can get it right why the **** can't these idiots take some advice from their peers and solve the problem themselves?

[parksey]

Agree 100% you can't police the RBB etc but by standing with them to some it looks like you are supporting their behaviour.


only if you have literally ignored countless explanations of why people are doing this

[hawk]

If 7/8 clubs can get it right why the **** can't these idiots take some advice from their peers and solve the problem themselves?

see my answer

[plague]

only if you have literally ignored countless explanations of why people are doing this
Not ignoring.
Just don't buy it.
There's a difference.

You honestly think that if the FFA comes out tomorrow and says "ok here's your appeals process exactly like you wanted" the idiot behaviour stops?
Man, I'll take that bet with anyone.

Good luck with it though, just remember to turn your lights off during earth hour to save the planet.

[GazFish35]

We can't do anything about how the rbb and NTC police their own members. However is worth noting that all the other groups do self police and have much less or none (as in the squadrons case) of these issues.



Yes you can.
We can boycott the boycott until they start showing they're genuine when they say they are against anti-social behavior.... They've been arguing actions speak louder than words - its all rhetoric until they start effectively self policing.

They bang on about unity, if 7/10 clubs have actives who aren't causing major issues, and are self policing, then the other three need to change their own culture.

Get the other 6 to boycott the boycott and return to the games in full voice and good behavior next week and offer support to the other three when they show they are serious about weeding out the guilty from the innocent amongst their own.


Otherwise we are just being used as a pawn in an ego game between three fan groups and the FFA.
We're fighting a fight that isn't ours, because we've already started the hard work the other three refuse to.
If they're claiming is about protecting innocent fans... I'll say it again, they to do more to differentiate the guilty from the innocent.

[parksey]

You honestly think that if the FFA comes out tomorrow and says "ok here's your appeals process exactly like you wanted" the idiot behaviour stops?
Man, I'll take that bet with anyone.

yeah i don't think anyone has said that either

[sammydog]

Yes you can.
We can boycott the boycott until they start showing they're genuine when they say they are against anti-social behavior.... They've been arguing actions speak louder than words - its all rhetoric until they start effectively self policing.

They bang on about unity, if 7/10 clubs have actives who aren't causing major issues, and are self policing, then the other three need to change their own culture.

Get the other 6 to boycott the boycott and return to the games in full voice and good behavior next week and offer support to the other three when they show they are serious about weeding out the guilty from the innocent amongst their own.


Otherwise we are just being used as a pawn in an ego game between three fan groups and the FFA.
We're fighting a fight that isn't ours, because we've already started the hard work the other three refuse to.
If they're claiming is about protecting innocent fans... I'll say it again, they to do more to differentiate the guilty from the innocent.

And this is exactly how I see it. The remainder of the groups outside the RBB, NT and a lesser extent the cove, are being taken for a ride here by the RBB and NT. And in doing so, they are dragging their own image down.

I don't see the active support from the Jets, Glory, Adelaide, Mariners, Roar, etc represented in anyway similar numbers to the aforementioned groups. I don't see regular issues from any of these groups. The RBB and NT have done nothing in the past to show they want to stop the shit, but cry when security comes down on them. Tough shit, come to the table like you expect the FFA to and start cleaning up your act. If they want some leadership, its time to show some leadership beyond taking your bat and ball and ****ing off home.

The FFA could put in the best appeals process ever tomorrow, and the same shit will still carry on from those groups and they will still complain about security/police etc. If they clean up their act, the rest falls into place.

[plague]

yeah i don't think anyone has said that either
Your assists in this thread have been Broich-like.
I commend you on your execution.

[Blackmac79]

Worthwhile reading in the SMH today about the meeting that will take place with ALL supporters clubs on a range of issues, and that there will also be a meeting with the ffa and those on the same day.

Dillon's write up however misses the point and continues to show his own bias against active supporters that he has held for a long time.

I am vary wary of boycotts. However I am fairly sick of the FFA utilising us as advertising material and then treating us like second class citizens, or allowing us to be treated as such. We may not have the same issues in Newcastle as in the RBB or NT, but Too often it security/police etc. treat us as though we have already committed a crime just for being at the football.

The issues extends beyond the 198 and the issue of bans, but tithe fact that you can be banned unjustly because of the presumption of guilt that is placed on you for going to the football.

[The Dunster]

Reduce the number of police and security at games and the only difference will be less shit going down and more people enjoying themselves. Never in my life have I been thankful that police or seccos have been present at any sporting fixtures - and I've been to plenty.
Their presence only fuels the anger and anti-social behaviour - which a lot of the time they crave. I have seen seccos and police take some guy down who'd be lucky to be 80kg ringing wet and then be fist pumping each other about it. Ridiculous.

I have never felt uncomfortable at a game because of any fans behaviour but on many occasions the behaviour of police and security I have found to be overly aggressive and not warranted.

You get the odd good cop or secco but the system usually weeds them out pretty quickly in favour of the narcissistic types we often see at A-League fixtures.

[Blackmac79]

https://peterfilopoulos.wordpress.com/2015/12/06/they-know-we-are-coming/

Worth reading from glory CEO

[stopper2]

https://peterfilopoulos.wordpress.com/2015/12/06/they-know-we-are-coming/

Worth reading from glory CEO

Yes, I read that one earlier today, goes much further into depth at the issues then Dillon's half-baked attempt in yesterdays herald which only scraped the surface. Haven't been on the Foz for a few days and have come back on today and have to say that it's disappointing that there are many on here with opinions based on looking at the issues from one small angle. Come on fellas lift your game, at the flick of a button nowadays you can do a little bit of research and fact-finding and have a read from people who really know their stuff on why it has come to this.....fighting within

FFA CEO David Gallop back on probation with fans after failing to defend the game
Mike Cockerill
http://www.smh.com.au/sport/soccer/ffa-ceo-david-gallop-back-on-probation-with-fans-after-failing-to-defend-the-game-20151203-glf70k.html

Here's another good read from Dave Davutovic
How FFA scored 32 own goals in 18 months and CEO David Gallop still kept his job
http://www.news.com.au/sport/football/a-league/how-ffa-scored-32-own-goals-in-18-months-and-ceo-david-gallop-still-kept-his-job/news-story/b53bedbf39ee441ba5d8ac804ddf9e3a

[Wilso8948]

Me and my mate was booted from Allianz on Friday. Was yelling shit out ripping on Hoole and taking the piss out of the jets when we went behind. But never stepping over the line. Had a bunch of Sydney supporters pissing themselves at some of our comments. Was a good laugh. Had two policemen surround us and ask us to leave as we were offending people around us. I walked out yelling "199".. That bad? Should I have just ripped a flare instead?

This whole shits getting beyond a joke.

[Wilso8948]

http://www.openjournal.com.au/wp-content/uploads/sites/62/2014/04/SCG-The-Hill-1982_LR.jpg

:wub:

This is 1982 see if you can spot the seccos or boutique cats piss beer in plastic cups..

I swear that photo was on the front of the herald after the "reclaim Australia" rally the other day.

[lquiquer]

https://peterfilopoulos.wordpress.com/2015/12/06/they-know-we-are-coming/

Worth reading from glory CEO

Good read ... Spot on PF...

[weston]

Me and my mate was booted from Allianz on Friday. Was yelling shit out ripping on Hoole and taking the piss out of the jets when we went behind. But never stepping over the line. Had a bunch of Sydney supporters pissing themselves at some of our comments. Was a good laugh. Had two policemen surround us and ask us to leave as we were offending people around us. I walked out yelling "199".. That bad? Should I have just ripped a flare instead?

This whole shits getting beyond a joke.

Not even a "tone it down", "pull your head in" before getting booted?

[Wilso8948]

Not even a "tone it down", "pull your head in" before getting booted?

Just the old "come to the back for a chat." Then continued to waste our time explaining that I used bad language and I asked what I said as I hadn't used any bad language. They just rolled their eyes and said the games nearly over we should go home. Just typical when they can't win an argument they resort to a power trip.

[stopper2]

Find it interesting too that many on here seem to have short memories of the way FFA allowed our club to virtually die a slow death from a thousand cuts administered by Tinkler and his sidekick Muppet last season. When Tinkler announced prior to the season that he had virtually had enough of owning the club, that should have been enough from FFA to start proceedings to take the licence back off him but no, they allowed it to drag on in the hope they could recoup some money with a sale.
Then when Tinkler announces his backflip, Baartz and Middleby resign, they allow Tinkler for the next 4 months to treat not only this club but this proud football region and the A League as a whole with utter contempt...outstanding bills, late player payments, not to mention mass sackings of staff and players etc.
To top it off, it comes out that Tinkler was only able to pay the bills and wages over those months because of the generosity of millionaire Gerry Harvey, which FFA would have clearly been aware of.
Fast forward a few months and the FFA takes over, from the beginning at the Forums De Bohun clearly states that there will be no Marquees, that everthing will be kept to a minimum. Not even utilising some of the other concessions such as the "Archie Rule" on players like BK and Kanta where possibly half their wages could be salary cap exempt so that it could be used to buy a more experienced player.
In effect we are basically going into battle with pump-action shot-guns while the big boys of the competition, your Victory's, SFC and City have AK-47's....yeah thanks for bailing us out FFA

[stopper2]

I swear that photo was on the front of the herald after the "reclaim Australia" rally the other day.

Can't say that mate, they're good old Aussie larrikans havin a beer and a good time:blink: not like those bloody Wanderers RBB, bloody terrorist wogs the lot of them ay.

[Wilso8948]

Hahaha

[plague]

Anyone see Anges comments on Offsiders this morning?
interesting.
any of the "propa sockah fans" on here want to rip the bloke?
get stuck in boiz.

[plague]

Come on fellas lift your game, at the flick of a button nowadays you can do a little bit of research and fact-finding and have a read from people who really know their stuff on why it has come to this.....

holy moly you are right.
i checked the internet and whilst i didn't find out anything to do with your little protests there, I did find out that jet fuel can't melt steel beams.

#staywoke

[Blackmac79]

Anyone see Anges comments on Offsiders this morning?
interesting.
any of the "propa sockah fans" on here want to rip the bloke?
get stuck in boiz.

Didn't watch offsides but heard him talk to Francis Leach over the weekend. Wouldn't see why the "propa" fans would want to get stuck in. Unless of course The FFA has made him change his mind on the issue, wouldn't be the first time.

[plague]

Didn't watch offsides but heard him talk to Francis Leach over the weekend. Wouldn't see why the "propa" fans would want to get stuck in. Unless of course The FFA has made him change his mind on the issue, wouldn't be the first time.

I don't know what he said earlier in the week but he was pretty critical of the whole situation and everyone's part in it (FFA included).
I honestly don't think he was on anyone's side in it.

[Blackmac79]

I don't know what he said earlier in the week but he was pretty critical of the whole situation and everyone's part in it (FFA included).
I honestly don't think he was on anyone's side in it.

Yeh that about sums up what he said to frannie.

[MFKS]

Find it interesting too that many on here seem to have short memories of the way FFA allowed our club to virtually die a slow death from a thousand cuts administered by Tinkler and his sidekick Muppet last season. When Tinkler announced prior to the season that he had virtually had enough of owning the club, that should have been enough from FFA to start proceedings to take the licence back off him but no, they allowed it to drag on in the hope they could recoup some money with a sale.
Then when Tinkler announces his backflip, Baartz and Middleby resign, they allow Tinkler for the next 4 months to treat not only this club but this proud football region and the A League as a whole with utter contempt...outstanding bills, late player payments, not to mention mass sackings of staff and players etc.
To top it off, it comes out that Tinkler was only able to pay the bills and wages over those months because of the generosity of millionaire Gerry Harvey, which FFA would have clearly been aware of.
Fast forward a few months and the FFA takes over, from the beginning at the Forums De Bohun clearly states that there will be no Marquees, that everthing will be kept to a minimum. Not even utilising some of the other concessions such as the "Archie Rule" on players like BK and Kanta where possibly half their wages could be salary cap exempt so that it could be used to buy a more experienced player.
In effect we are basically going into battle with pump-action shot-guns while the big boys of the competition, your Victory's, SFC and City have AK-47's....yeah thanks for bailing us out FFA

Everything you say there is right. No dispute about the incompetence of the FFA in dealing with our club when Tinkler was here and now they are running it on the smell of an oily rag.

Me I am quite happy to have a kick at the FFA anytime you want for the general failings they have of running the game in this country. FFS I hate them more than the next guy

Thing is though the issue here has little to do with them at all.

The issue is a fan issue and has little bearing on anyone other than the FANS

Fans need to pull their heads in and control the problem.

Particularly the NT and RBB the main offenders
The other 8 clubs are pretty much fine

As for the general security issues at games sure as shit it needs to improve

Last home game was sitting there after Kanta scored and the Bay is going nuts. 2 Big Braindead bouncers come into the bay and start talking an eyeing up some kid who was pushing about 6 years old who was apparently the biggest threat in the stadium because he was enjoying himself too much.

FMD

I have been given an official warning at a Roar home game for leaning on the fence. All I did was turn around to listen to the dribble from some over zealous Nazi who was giving all 20 of us there a spraying for having a good time and as I did I casually lent against a fence made of steel beams. Some other Nazi though it was worth his time to come over and threaten to boot me out for listening to his colleague.
FMD

I have been to a Victree home game where everyone wearing Jets gear was checked at ridiculous levels when they entered the away bay. Yet for some reason later on the 20-30 Victree fans in civvies were not checked let alone removed when they sat there causing shit and celebrating anything good the Tards done
FMD

I have been to a Heart home game where 7 of us were made to sit in one part of the bay and the other 8 were made to sit in the other part of the bay
The bouncers though it was easier for the 6 of them and 6 coppers to keep an eye on us this way.
The only thing we done was one group came into the bay from the left entry the other lot from the right entry
FMD

From what I have seen the worst in the HAL are Suncorp and AAMI by a long long way.

This is an area that needs to improve out of sight also and has nothing to do with the FFA but the security companies and clubs getting together and working out what the **** they are doing

[plague]

Man, all I can hope for is that either this club folds or you guys keep protesting and find something else to do outside of football because the level of misery on here is really worrying.
Some of you guys are really sick and need help.
Please go get it. Life is too short to be so goddamn miserable all the time.

[stopper2]

Man, all I can hope for is that either this club folds or you guys keep protesting and find something else to do outside of football because the level of misery on here is really worrying.
Some of you guys are really sick and need help.
Please go get it. Life is too short to be so goddamn miserable all the time.

Now that's the kettle calling the pot black!

One says something positive, YOU tear into them.
You must be one of the most miserable, negative ****s on this Foz. Seem to want to argue against someones opinion just for the sake of it.

[stopper2]

Everything you say there is right. No dispute about the incompetence of the FFA in dealing with our club when Tinkler was here and now they are running it on the smell of an oily rag.

Me I am quite happy to have a kick at the FFA anytime you want for the general failings they have of running the game in this country. FFS I hate them more than the next guy

Thing is though the issue here has little to do with them at all.

The issue is a fan issue and has little bearing on anyone other than the FANS

Fans need to pull their heads in and control the problem.

Particularly the NT and RBB the main offenders
The other 8 clubs are pretty much fine

As for the general security issues at games sure as shit it needs to improve

Last home game was sitting there after Kanta scored and the Bay is going nuts. 2 Big Braindead bouncers come into the bay and start talking an eyeing up some kid who was pushing about 6 years old who was apparently the biggest threat in the stadium because he was enjoying himself too much.

FMD

I have been given an official warning at a Roar home game for leaning on the fence. All I did was turn around to listen to the dribble from some over zealous Nazi who was giving all 20 of us there a spraying for having a good time and as I did I casually lent against a fence made of steel beams. Some other Nazi though it was worth his time to come over and threaten to boot me out for listening to his colleague.
FMD

I have been to a Victree home game where everyone wearing Jets gear was checked at ridiculous levels when they entered the away bay. Yet for some reason later on the 20-30 Victree fans in civvies were not checked let alone removed when they sat there causing shit and celebrating anything good the Tards done
FMD

I have been to a Heart home game where 7 of us were made to sit in one part of the bay and the other 8 were made to sit in the other part of the bay
The bouncers though it was easier for the 6 of them and 6 coppers to keep an eye on us this way.
The only thing we done was one group came into the bay from the left entry the other lot from the right entry
FMD

From what I have seen the worst in the HAL are Suncorp and AAMI by a long long way.

This is an area that needs to improve out of sight also and has nothing to do with the FFA but the security companies and clubs getting together and working out what the **** they are doing

Member, no denying there is an element in particular the RBB and NT that are doing the game or their clubs no favours and they either need to tone down their act or just piss off away from the A league.
Okay you are saying that the overzealous security has nothing to do with the FFA but fans have been complaining for a while now about this issue at games, shouldn't the FFA as the governing body try to address this with security, clubs and supporter groups and try to solve the issue, rather than let it come to head where we are now seeing boycotts.
What you have mentioned with your own experiences unfortunately doesn't get mentioned in the mainstream media however, same as the Wanderers supporter who was issued with a ban when he was not even at the said game and was in fact overseas!

[BodyNovo]

go the jets :lulzturtle:

[plague]

Now that's the kettle calling the pot black!

One says something positive, YOU tear into them.
You must be one of the most miserable, negative ****s on this Foz. Seem to want to argue against someones opinion just for the sake of it.

I mean, do any of you guys want to jump in here and help my brother out?

[plague]

Now that's the kettle calling the pot black!

One says something positive, YOU tear into them.
You must be one of the most miserable, negative ****s on this Foz. Seem to want to argue against someones opinion just for the sake of it.

Hey my brother it's not my fault I'm always right.
you should try it sometime, we'd get along better.

[MFKS]

Member, no denying there is an element in particular the RBB and NT that are doing the game or their clubs no favours and they either need to tone down their act or just piss off away from the A league.
Okay you are saying that the overzealous security has nothing to do with the FFA but fans have been complaining for a while now about this issue at games, shouldn't the FFA as the governing body try to address this with security, clubs and supporter groups and try to solve the issue, rather than let it come to head where we are now seeing boycotts.
What you have mentioned with your own experiences unfortunately doesn't get mentioned in the mainstream media however, same as the Wanderers supporter who was issued with a ban when he was not even at the said game and was in fact overseas!

Why is that the FFA's job though??

It is the club hosting the game who is responsible for organising security

Problem is they take no responsibility here as they sub contract it out to the likes of NES, E Group etc

This security company then employs anyone they can get to fill their contracts. As a result you can get a variety of people who are stationed to work at a sporting event who do not have the people skills or ability to do the job.

Problem lies with the clubs who can employ the security directly themselves. They choose not to because they are too lazy to do so. They have the ability to train and coordinate the security staff then if they are paying them and tailoring the way they operate to their clientele

Football fans are a different breed of people. Maybe if our security staff were actually given appropriate training to understand what is going on we have less problems.

Problem is everyone wants to blame the FFA for the individual clubs choice in Security provider??

Why??

[The Dunster]

Why is that the FFA's job though??

It is the club hosting the game who is responsible for organising security

Problem is they take no responsibility here as they sub contract it out to the likes of NES, E Group etc

This security company then employs anyone they can get to fill their contracts. As a result you can get a variety of people who are stationed to work at a sporting event who do not have the people skills or ability to do the job.

Problem lies with the clubs who can employ the security directly themselves. They choose not to because they are too lazy to do so. They have the ability to train and coordinate the security staff then if they are paying them and tailoring the way they operate to their clientele

Football fans are a different breed of people. Maybe if our security staff were actually given appropriate training to understand what is going on we have less problems.

Problem is everyone wants to blame the FFA for the individual clubs choice in Security provider??

Why??

The security companies involved make a lot of money out of these contracts and as such have grown quite powerful [politically speaking] over the years.

There is simply no way anything any of us say will have any bearing what so ever on the future of the these Security companies at A-League fixtures.

The only true way to hurt them is to simply stop going to games - which is something I have been considering for several years.

Overall, the Security firms have become too big and their influence is totally ruining sport in Australia.

I think we are at the point now that if a dozen or so Seccos raped and bashed a six year old girl the FFA and stadium management would probably ban the girl for life and nominate the Secco's for bravery and comminity service awards . It's that fooked up.

[plague]

Why??

Because football clubs would be morons for employing thier own security.
Just another layer of potential lawsuits waiting to happen.
Never mind the fact you are liable for everything they do yet are unable to govern how they behave.
Employees are the worst.


Middleby and co are smart to keep this at arms length.

[The Dunster]

Be side football clubs would be morons for employing thier own security.
Just another layer of potential lawsuits waiting to happen.
Never mind the fact you are liable for everything they do yet are unable to govern how they behave.
Employees are the worst.
Middleby and co are smart to keep this at arms length.

Wouldn't bad employees be a problem that you can source back to Human Resources not knowing shit from clay ?

The lawsuits is again another product of neo-liberalism which is ground zero when it comes to factoring out state responsibilities to the private sector.

It's a nasty game indeed.

[MFKS]

Because football clubs would be morons for employing thier own security.
Just another layer of potential lawsuits waiting to happen.
Never mind the fact you are liable for everything they do yet are unable to govern how they behave.
Employees are the worst.


Middleby and co are smart to keep this at arms length.

As for the liability thing...


The same insurances the security companies already take out for them being found liable for the actions of their staff ??
The same money the football club actually already pays anyway as it is factored into the security company's pricing arrangement with them??

Yep


Lets just cut out the middle man here

Secondly if the club is employing them then how they behave is down to the way the club selects and trains their staff in the first place.

Thirdly the way of football clubs employing their own security rather than private firms and their pool of brain dead gorillas works well in other nations. Why would it not work here??

[plague]

Wouldn't bad employees be a problem that you can source back to Human Resources not knowing shit from clay ?


Yeah I should clarify, I don't think there are necessarily 'bad employees'.
I think there are bad people and bad workplace laws. Combine those two and there you have it.

As for lawsuits, not sure who to blame but people suing bars because they get caught drink driving, someone burning their mouth on a hot coffee and someone punching out their girlfriend because they had a rough childhood.

Again, bad people and bad laws.
Hatamoto etc just getting away with what they can.

Don't hate the playa etc ect etc.

[plague]

The same insurances the security companies already take out for them being found liable for the actions of their staff ??
The same money the football club actually already pays anyway as it is factored into the security company's pricing arrangement with them??

Yep


Lets just cut out the middle man here

Secondly if the club is employing them then how they behave is down to the way the club selects and trains their staff in the first place.


Because the difference between sacking an underperforming employee and deciding not to renew a contract can not be measured in dollars and cents.
Also, on costs like training/compliance, holiday pay etc for full time employees can be avoided by cherry picking staff from an agency and only paying for the time they are on the job.

But I'm assuming you want highly trained employees who are available for 6 hours or so once every 2 weeks for 6 months of they year to be right there when you need them.
And of course some weekends you won't need as many (varying crowd numbers) so those employees can just chill on full pay yeah?

Good luck with that boss.

Your sentiment is right, your math is wrong.

[The Dunster]

Yeah I should clarify, I don't think there are necessarily 'bad employees'.
I think there are bad people and bad workplace laws. Combine those two and there you have it.

As for lawsuits, not sure who to blame but people suing bars because they get caught drink driving, someone burning their mouth on a hot coffee and someone punching out their girlfriend because they had a rough childhood.

Again, bad people and bad laws.
Hatamoto etc just getting away with what they can.

Don't hate the playa etc ect etc.

Meanwhile the ambulance chasers are making a fortune riding this wave.

[furns]

Just to clarify to everybody, security companies are hired by the stadiums not the clubs. The clubs don't have any say apart from lobbying the stadium management when the tender comes up for review. The stadium is actually directly responsible for crowd safety & security on match day not the club, so they are the ones in charge of security & coordinating with police.
While I agree that we have had issues with both NES and Egroup at various stages throughout the 11 years of the aleague, all we can do at this point is work with who is there. Having said that, the squadron committee can't go to the stadium management (who we have an ok relationship with) to suggest issues if no one lets us know of these issues to begin with.
If you have specific instances of security overstepping their boundaries please do us an email to squadronfsc@gmail.com so we can start collating this sort of information. Dates, times and names would be beneficial.

[MFKS]

Just to clarify to everybody, security companies are hired by the stadiums not the clubs. The clubs don't have any say apart from lobbying the stadium management when the tender comes up for review. The stadium is actually directly responsible for crowd safety & security on match day not the club, so they are the ones in charge of security & coordinating with police.
While I agree that we have had issues with both NES and Egroup at various stages throughout the 11 years of the aleague, all we can do at this point is work with who is there. Having said that, the squadron committee can't go to the stadium management (who we have an ok relationship with) to suggest issues if no one lets us know of these issues to begin with.
If you have specific instances of security overstepping their boundaries please do us an email to squadronfsc@gmail.com so we can start collating this sort of information. Dates, times and names would be beneficial.


So we are dealing with the same clowns who can't get a decent pitch most weeks???

FMD

[furns]

When the govt weren't giving them the money to actually get the shit fixed - yes.
That pitch hadn't been replaced in over twenty years.
Now that the money has been spent putting down a proper drainage system and hybrid turf - its now rated one of the best surfaces in the country.

All the extra money goes to sydney venues, see the recent announcement to tear down Allianz and put a roof on that abortion of a stadium at Homebush. At a cost of several billion, and Hunter Stadium can't get a measly 20mil to finish stage 4&5 of the redevelopment that's been planned for the last decade.

[plague]

I think it's great that I'll soon be able to catch an imaginary light rail into the ground to sit in the imaginary southern grandstand.

[furns]

Statement released via FB earlier today

The Squadron FSC can confirm that a meeting is being organised by a third party, between the representatives of all active supporter groups and FFA CEO David Gallop and Head of the A League Damien DeBohun.

This meeting will be held on Wednesday evening, where current issues will be discussed and hopefully addressed.

We have been communicating with leaders of the other active supporter groups in order to go into this meeting with clear objectives and expectations of what is required from the FFA in order to end our protests. These objectives are consistent across all fan groups as is our commitment to co-operating with everyone involved in order to find a solution.

The FFA has been aware of these issues for a number of years and we have only reached this point with the support of every fan who has supported the cause. We will continue to stand up for our rights and the rights of every single person who attends a FFA sanctioned event. The outcome of Wednesday's meeting, and subsequent actions will be dependent solely on FFA's willingness to address those issues fully.

One thing is certain. Change will only come about through unity of the fans.

This is not about avoiding punishment for those who do wrong. We don't want or expect special treatment, simply fairness.

We will keep everyone updated on the outcome of this meeting and future actions.

We would like to thank the organiser for their commitment and effort in making this happen.

[plague]

hey Mr Furns legit question, in your dealings with other groups (I'm assuming you are one of the contact points for Newcastle active) has there been any discussion as to what the active groups are going to give the FFA in this meeting?
In the statement above there is a clear message about what you want them to do, but has there been any thought about what you are going to give them in reutrn? Do you have a united position or are each group discussing these things differently?


cheers,
Plague.

[furns]

The groups are reaching consensus via discussion to reach a united position. We are currently working through a list of items to present to the FFA.
I can't really go into further details at the moment unfortunately.

[lquiquer]

Apparently **someone Kevin airs is strongly suggesting might sue if you mention his name** hey!!!....

[WolfMan]

hey Mr Furns legit question, in your dealings with other groups (I'm assuming you are one of the contact points for Newcastle active) has there been any discussion as to what the active groups are going to give the FFA in this meeting?
In the statement above there is a clear message about what you want them to do, but has there been any thought about what you are going to give them in reutrn? Do you have a united position or are each group discussing these things differently?


cheers,
Plague.

Hang on, so now we have to give people something to get a fair appeals process in place? Something that should have been part and parcel of the whole process to begin with.

Dead set LMAO

[Blackmac79]

Apparently **someone Kevin airs is strongly suggesting might sue if you mention his name* hey!!!....

guy has always been a snide prick.

Time to go Mr **someone Kevin airs is strongly suggesting might sue if you mention his name*.

[plague]

Hang on, so now we have to give people something to get a fair appeals process in place? Something that should have been part and parcel of the whole process to begin with.

Dead set LMAO

yes, just like the banning of flares was part and parcel from the beginning. Didn't stop you* thumbing your nose at that, why are you shocked the FFA told you to go **** yourselves over the appeals thing?
y'all can't be that naive right?

Good negotiating:
"hey we want this, and you want this if we both get what we want then its a win win".

Bad negotiating:
"hey, we demand all of this, and we give you nothing in return".

Now: considering that 'this' is something that doesnt matter to 9 out of the 10 supporter groups then you are effectively giving up nothing in return for what you want.

Thats good negotiating.

All the 9/10 supporter groups need to do is demand that the 1/10 (i.e. the minority) change their ways. Once again, the RBB wants something from you (your support) then they need to give up something in return (the behaviour).
thats good negotiating.

*once you align yourselves with the other supporter groups rightly or wrongly you are lumped in with them. If this turns feral it tarnishes all of you, if theres a good outcome then you all look good. No half measures, the media isn't bothering with nuance in this debate. accept it because thats the reality of the situation.

[GazFish35]

Media doesn't do nuance at all.
Not sure news corp particularly could even spell it.

Most frustrating thing is, some journos know there's way more detail than they report but choose to tell the dumbed down version to inflame things.

Gerard wheately won a sports journalism award a few weeks ago, yet his coverage of the issue on offsides was pathetic.

[plague]

Gerard wheately won a sports journalism award a few weeks ago, yet his coverage of the issue on offsides was pathetic.

What did you find so pathetic about it?
From what I saw with Postecogolou on Sunday I thought he was quite benign about it all.

They both seemed to encourage fans to get over the media criticism as its nothing new or isolated to football.

I swear Wheatley was 'pro appeals process'? Did you hear differently?

I thought Anges comments about no one 'owning the game' were way more scathing of the behaviour of pretty much everyone involved.

[The Dunster]

I think it's great that I'll soon be able to catch an imaginary light rail into the ground to sit in the imaginary southern grandstand.

watching the Jets imaginary midfield

[plague]

watching the Jets imaginary midfield

Bravo sir.

[GazFish35]

What did you find so pathetic about it?
From what I saw with Postecogolou on Sunday I thought he was quite benign about it all.

They both seemed to encourage fans to get over the media criticism as its nothing new or isolated to football.

I swear Wheatley was 'pro appeals process'? Did you hear differently?

I thought Anges comments about no one 'owning the game' were way more scathing of the behaviour of pretty much everyone involved.




I thought his comments wreaked of assuming the whole protest was about supporting the 198, when it's clearly more than that.
he also made the comment that brandishing the mainstream media as out to get football was wrong, that we should accuse them of such when its only 3 people in said media..... he seems to forget the RW doesn't decide what's front page news, editors do. There may well be more recognition of the game than there once was, but the coverage is still shallow and uneducated, but maybe that's just a refelection on all sports journalism.

[MFKS]

I thought his comments wreaked of assuming the whole protest was about supporting the 198, when it's clearly more than that.
he also made the comment that brandishing the mainstream media as out to get football was wrong, that we should accuse them of such when its only 3 people in said media..... he seems to forget the RW doesn't decide what's front page news, editors do. There may well be more recognition of the game than there once was, but the coverage is still shallow and uneducated, but maybe that's just a refelection on all sports journalism.

The coverage of the game has grown out of sight in the last 20 years from the media in this country.

Problem is the journos covering the game are wither not football tragics and have another code they love or are football tragics but lousy journos but have no idea what they are talking about when it comes to being able to getting the big issues out there in a balanced way.

When you do find someone who has the ability to do this they are not really speaking to the masses but an already established demographic of football fans

[GazFish35]

Agreed, so I thought Wheatley should have shut up in the issue and let Ange explain it rather than editorialize it by simplifying down too much an using the platform for what he thinks the actives should do, which was essentially shit the **** up and stop complaining..... Which if he had any idea what we are complaining about he'd have not simplified it incorrectly.

[plague]

I thought his comments wreaked of assuming the whole protest was about supporting the 198, when it's clearly more than that.
he also made the comment that brandishing the mainstream media as out to get football was wrong, that we should accuse them of such when its only 3 people in said media..... he seems to forget the RW doesn't decide what's front page news, editors do. There may well be more recognition of the game than there once was, but the coverage is still shallow and uneducated, but maybe that's just a refelection on all sports journalism.

Yeah, the comment about 'standing with the 198' was in reference to a sign at the SFC game. It was the same logic used by a lot of commentators when this popped up on the news:
http://independentaustralia.net/wordpress-opt/wp-content/2012/06/AbbottDitchWitch.jpg

Sadly with increased exposure comes increased scrutiny. football is still such a long way from the debate around of AFL and NRL its not funny. and yes the fans of those sports have been the subject of many inches of column space (remember when all AFL fans were racists if they booed Adam Goodes?).

and do we really want sympathetic reporting all the time? doesn't that just end up like politics where everyone has a 'side' and thats the only angle you get? id rather people like Wheately discuss these issues from an outside perspective, I'm more inclined to learn something from him rather than an Andy Paschalidis type who just says that every is rose 24/7 and football has nothing to worry about.

[GazFish35]

Not after sympathetic reporting, just balanced.

[plague]

Not after sympathetic reporting, just balanced.

Yeah I honestly think across all media platforms the coverage is balanced.

Opinions and all that though.

it's never as bad as it sounds and it's never as good as it sounds.

[Blackmac79]

David Squires sums things up in a humorous way.

http://www.theguardian.com/sport/picture/2015/dec/03/david-squires-on-the-response-to-a-league-fan-protests


Hoping the meeting tonight goes well. I don't feel like continuing to boycott. What is important is that there are 8-9/10 clubs on the same page looking for a deal. The cause will go with the majority.

[lquiquer]

Meeting in its fourth hour now Gatty tweeted

[plague]

Meeting in its fourth hour now Gatty tweeted

prob still arguing which supporter group gets to wear the light blue shirts to the meeting

[q-money]

NT & RBB have the nads to continue the boycott, i don't reckon anyone else will and the whole thing will fall apart and everyone ends up worse off as compared to where they started

lowy wins, as always, ergo the cove

[GazFish35]

RBB and NT throughout this whole shitfight seem too keen to flex their muscle.

I hope they realize the FFA conceded some ground and the timelines they've been calling for have been ridiculous.

If they want to continue The boycott I hope the other 8 groups tell them to get ****ed.

[plague]

Please please please tell me someone invoked the Geneva convention.

[hawk]

RBB and NT throughout this whole shitfight seem too keen to flex their muscle.

.

Remember its they who have the most to lose and gain. The minnow clubs are being dragged along but given the impression that they are something.

[BodyNovo]

Remember its they who have the most to lose and gain. The minnow clubs are being dragged along but given the impression that they are something.

first point true. 2nd point incorrect. all clubs were equally involved and represented that way. I think furns would agree that we weren't dragged along through this.

[furns]

http://www.theherald.com.au/story/3551659/timely-truce-spares-jets-from-boycott/

Also did interviews earlier today with ABC Newy & KOFM for their news grabs. Hopefully it gave ppl a little more info,
Sorry we couldn't be more forthcoming during some stages of the process but we needed to ensure that info we were working on in conjunction with the other groups didn't leak out to the FFA before the meeting. They were a little taken aback I think with the organisation & preparation that we went into the meeting with.
This will also help us down the track as the FFA have now indicated they would like meetings on a more regular basis.

[Jeterpool]

Well done Furns. Great work

[Hunter403]

Good stuff Furns

[parksey]

onya furns

[RAM]

so what was actually achieved?

[lquiquer]

so what was actually achieved?

Rebecca Wilson and Alan Jones are in Jail and the 198 are free

[furns]

so what was actually achieved?
The FFA finally began to engage with supporters like stakeholders in the game, rather than dictating to them like children.
Fans will be served with an "intention to ban" prior to the ban commencing, importantly they will also be provided the evidence being relied upon to ban them
Fans will have the opportunity to appeal their ban to a panel that is independent of the FFA.
The FFA have also given an undertaking to defend the sport and the overwhelming majority of fans that do the right thing when attacked in the media

[plague]

Was there much discussion of the flares etc?
According to Dave Divudovuc (who heard it from his source - therefore 3rd hand news) there was only the usual 'we don't condone it but it's not us' etc.
You think there's going to be a Christmas miracle and the flares disappear?

[RAM]

The FFA finally began to engage with supporters like stakeholders in the game, rather than dictating to them like children.
Fans will be served with an "intention to ban" prior to the ban commencing, importantly they will also be provided the evidence being relied upon to ban them
Fans will have the opportunity to appeal their ban to a panel that is independent of the FFA.
The FFA have also given an undertaking to defend the sport and the overwhelming majority of fans that do the right thing when attacked in the media

most supporter groups are comprised of children though

[furns]

Was there much discussion of the flares etc?
According to Dave Divudovuc (who heard it from his source - therefore 3rd hand news) there was only the usual 'we don't condone it but it's not us' etc.
You think there's going to be a Christmas miracle and the flares disappear?

Flares & anti social behaviour - people know it's not on so anyone choosing to do it anyway suffer the consequences.
If you're expecting RBB & NTC to come out like the other 8 groups with anti-flare/violence policy you will have to take it up with them. Along with a lot of their own clubs supporters.

[hawk]

so can we now go back to wsw and take on the pig rooters in the car park?

[hawk]

first point true. 2nd point incorrect. all clubs were equally involved and represented that way. I think furns would agree that we weren't dragged along through this.

lol. I think your over rating our importance. Theres no way us or coasties would have carried this off if the big 3 werent in.

[plague]

If you're expecting RBB & NTC to come out like the other 8 groups with anti-flare/violence policy you will have to take it up with them.

oh man, on the contrary, i want them all to light up the ground tonight like its new years eve.

it will put the most fantastic full stop on all of this nonsense.

[hawk]

On the whole I think we, the fans, have done alright out of this protest. kudos to the organisers

[furns]

oh man, on the contrary, i want them all to light up the ground tonight like its new years eve.

it will put the most fantastic full stop on all of this nonsense.
What nonsense?
Even the worst criminals get access to the evidence being used to convict them.
What fans were getting (innocent & guilty alike) were pronouncements of guilt with zero access to anything. This isn't North bloody Korea.
The protests were never about those who did the wrong thing. It was about making sure EVERYONE was getting a fair go.

[Jetmaster]

oh man, on the contrary, i want them all to light up the ground tonight like its new years eve.

it will put the most fantastic full stop on all of this nonsense.

Both sets of fans marching together to the stadium would put a full stop on it.

[plague]

Both sets of fans marching together to the stadium would put a full stop on it.

fantastic that the protest ended right before a top of the table blockbuster.
sheer luck that.

[plague]

R.I.P football 12/12/2015.

[lquiquer]

R.I.P football 12/12/2015.

too much plonk Plague?

[plague]

too much plonk Plague?

Nope.

Packed house, important match. rampaging home victory and not a smoke show in sight.

FFA just pulled everyones pants down.

its over, go home.

[lquiquer]

Nope.

Packed house, important match. rampaging home victory and not a smoke show in sight.

FFA just pulled everyones pants down.

its over, go home.

Flares will be back....you worry too much Plague .... I'm sure the One Gypo in Perf has got one

[plague]

Flares will be back....you worry too much Plague ....

can't come soon enough.
can't have general public thinking these fans aren't the toughest tools in the shed.

[Couscous]

Is there an active group that has never ripped a flare inside a stadium?

[furns]

Is there an active group that has never ripped a flare inside a stadium?
Yellow Fever

[plague]

No wonder Double Eff Aye want to kick them out.
Not proper fans.

[RAM]

Flares :cool::cool::cool::cool:

[Couscous]

Yellow Fever

Interesting. Why do you think that is?

[furns]

Interesting. Why do you think that is?
Because they dont care about getting their pictures all over ultras-tifo?

[GazFish35]

So. It's February.

What are the FFA doing about all this?

[furns]

We are meeting with FFA on Tues night as a part of their consultation process with active support groups.
There is a FFA board meeting in mid Feb where the banning process is expected to be presented for approval. After this it will be announced to the public.

[MFKS]

We are meeting with FFA on Tues night as a part of their consultation process with active support groups.
There is a FFA board meeting in mid Feb where the banning process is expected to be presented for approval. After this it will be announced to the public.

Off the record before or after meeting any chance you can speak to the halfwits running our club on the smell of an oily rag and suggest if they can't find us an owner ASAP to open the cheque book and run our club PROPERLY in the mean time??

[plague]

Aaahhhh, looks like the old 1% of fans that no one ever knows even though they are standing dead centre of the group are at it again.

[GazFish35]

Further proof the RBB are complete tossers.

[hawk]

Aaahhhh, looks like the old 1% of fans that no one ever knows even though they are standing dead centre of the group are at it again.



https://iainhall.files.wordpress.com/2014/04/housos-729-620x349.jpg

[belchardo]

Do wanderers have a suspended points deduction hanging over them if their fans behave like wanderers fans again? Surely if they do they must lose points.

[sammydog]

I thought that had expired.

[lquiquer]

Do wanderers have a suspended points deduction hanging over them if their fans behave like wanderers fans again? Surely if they do they must lose points.

WSW will never have points deducted.....FFA wanking about having A GF at ANZ with 80K......

[belchardo]

WSW will never have points deducted.....FFA wanking about having A GF at ANZ with 80K......

Pfft, they can just pull the same shit they did with us and say that adelaide/etihad/mcg/suncorp isn't big enough.

[lquiquer]

Pfft, they can just pull the same shit they did with us and say that adelaide/etihad/mcg/suncorp isn't big enough.

Yep but to get 80K they need a Sydney team (or even better 2) and at this stage Wankerers more likely to make it than FC.......