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Jules
30-03-2017, 02:42 PM
Hi all,

Just interested in opinions.

IMO this year has been the worst year for the Jets and it is at crisis point. It has made me ponder why I actually threw so much passion into football in the first place.

What it came down to was reading Johnny Warren's book "Sheilas, Wogs and Poofters" and being drawn into the mission of making our mark on the World stage. However, since the corruption of FIFA became so apparent, I've wondered how important it is to be part of a World Game. Globalisation doesn't seem so important anymore.

The Jets seem to lurch from one crisis to the next, there is no corporate support, both for corporate boxes or sponsorship. Where is it going?

I hate rugby league culture, so it made me think of missing piece of professional sport that isn't here in Newcastle, which is AFL. Given the rise of BBL, it is economically feasible for a circular stadium like GWS to be built in the Hunter and supply both summer and winter sport. I know that Hunter people would love access to cricket, and some of the AFL clubs in Newcastle are 130 years old.

What are people's thoughts on this? I just feel that the FFA and the Jets were handed the golden goose in Newcastle and it has been squandered. Maybe its time to try and attract an option that has nationwide backing from sponsors and commercial television?

The Dunster
30-03-2017, 03:15 PM
You are not going to get very far here with any proposal that doesn't include a fleet of paddle steamers.

StannyCFCJET
30-03-2017, 03:24 PM
Hi all,

Just interested in opinions.

IMO this year has been the worst year for the Jets and it is at crisis point. It has made me ponder why I actually threw so much passion into football in the first place.

What it came down to was reading Johnny Warren's book "Sheilas, Wogs and Poofters" and being drawn into the mission of making our mark on the World stage. However, since the corruption of FIFA became so apparent, I've wondered how important it is to be part of a World Game. Globalisation doesn't seem so important anymore.

The Jets seem to lurch from one crisis to the next, there is no corporate support, both for corporate boxes or sponsorship. Where is it going?

I hate rugby league culture, so it made me think of missing piece of professional sport that isn't here in Newcastle, which is AFL. Given the rise of BBL, it is economically feasible for a circular stadium like GWS to be built in the Hunter and supply both summer and winter sport. I know that Hunter people would love access to cricket, and some of the AFL clubs in Newcastle are 130 years old.

What are people's thoughts on this? I just feel that the FFA and the Jets were handed the golden goose in Newcastle and it has been squandered. Maybe its time to try and attract an option that has nationwide backing from sponsors and commercial television?

AFL??? nah you want that stuff go to melbourne

belchardo
30-03-2017, 03:39 PM
my thoughts are: if you want to lobby for an AFL team, go to an AFL site. I'd rather concentrate on bagging out the jets.

evolution
30-03-2017, 03:46 PM
Seagulls fighting over a hot chip. No thanks!

Jules
30-03-2017, 03:54 PM
my thoughts are: if you want to lobby for an AFL team, go to an AFL site. I'd rather concentrate on bagging out the jets.

Fair enough, but as a (former) Jets fan, I thought there might be some opinions at least. I simply can't see a future for the Jets. As a fan, I've been beating my head against a brick wall for the last 9 seasons. Then it dawned on me. The one thing that I've mocked rugby league and AFL for, the fact that it is not played in many countries, is actually an advantage. They can train a player knowing full well that he can't up an leave for more money overseas. They don't have to worry about a Andrew Hoole making unrealistic demands with threats to go to China. A global marketplace is actually a major disadvantage for a sport.

The promise of transfer fees in the A-League was just a pipe-dream.

I always thought that the A-League was the best alternative to thugby league culture, but now it seems like AFL might be the only way forward for our city.

Jules
30-03-2017, 03:55 PM
Seagulls fighting over a hot chip. No thanks!

As a goalkeeper, I thought you'd have a greater appreciation for AFL.

evolution
30-03-2017, 04:08 PM
As a goalkeeper, I thought you'd have a greater appreciation for AFL.

I appreciate the fitness levels required, no doubting that the players are elite athletes. However watching the game I've never been impressed with their ability to catch a ball. For every "speccy" that's taken there are 20 balls fumbled onto the ground.

The game itself is chaos, a completely unorganised clusterf*ck. Getting points for missing is also quite laughable.

Jules
30-03-2017, 04:12 PM
The game itself is chaos, a completely unorganised clusterf*ck.

And watching the Jets play compares favourably with this?

MFKS
30-03-2017, 04:16 PM
Fair enough, but as a (former) Jets fan, I thought there might be some opinions at least. I simply can't see a future for the Jets. As a fan, I've been beating my head against a brick wall for the last 9 seasons. Then it dawned on me. The one thing that I've mocked rugby league and AFL for, the fact that it is not played in many countries, is actually an advantage. They can train a player knowing full well that he can't up an leave for more money overseas. They don't have to worry about a Andrew Hoole making unrealistic demands with threats to go to China. A global marketplace is actually a major disadvantage for a sport.

The promise of transfer fees in the A-League was just a pipe-dream.

I always thought that the A-League was the best alternative to thugby league culture, but now it seems like AFL might be the only way forward for our city.
This just shows me you have NFI about football.

Your plastic attitude is noted
.

Go over and enjoy jumping on the bandwagon of some Tardball team

Let us know when your new game has a presence outside of this country.

The reason no one on the planet has adopted this game is because it is shit.

A point for missing FMD

evolution
30-03-2017, 04:19 PM
And watching the Jets play compares favourably with this?

I can't argue with this :rof:

Jules
30-03-2017, 04:24 PM
AFL??? nah you want that stuff go to melbourne

AFL is clearly national now. I lived in Sydney during the 1990s when Sydney Swans were huge. English friends of mine fell in love with the game. I mostly played soccer in my youth but played a few seasons of Aussie Rules in the local competition. It's not a bad sport. I don't remember ever being taught tactics but clearly at a professional level there is an opportunity to develop playings styles and tactics. It's just harder because, unlike football, there is no offside so teams can't constrain play to a small area of the pitch.

If there was an AFL team in Newcastle, would you go to a game? Given that the consensus is that the timing of seasons means that the Knights and Jets don't really compete.

Jules
30-03-2017, 04:27 PM
This just shows me you have NFI about football.

Your plastic attitude is noted
.

Go over and enjoy jumping on the bandwagon of some Tardball team

Let us know when your new game has a presence outside of this country.

The reason no one on the planet has adopted this game is because it is shit.

A point for missing FMD


Noone has adopted NFL so it must be shit. Noone has adopted baseball so it must be shit. Is that the idea?

Jules
30-03-2017, 04:36 PM
This just shows me you have NFI about football.

Your plastic attitude is noted

So tell me, what is going to help the Jets out of the position they are in? The league is becoming very uneven, the club has a new owner but he appears reluctant to splash any cash. We still have no sponsorship or corporate support, the Squadron is dead and ncl will probably be a mess. Good players just leave to play in better leagues, without us getting decent transfer fees. The club can't even translate the massive football community into spectators. Even if you ignore the inept administration of the club, what am I missing about football that convinces you that the Jets have a rosy future?

Since I have NFI, I assume you have all the answers.

MFKS
30-03-2017, 04:51 PM
So tell me, what is going to help the Jets out of the position they are in? The league is becoming very uneven, the club has a new owner but he appears reluctant to splash any cash. We still have no sponsorship or corporate support, the Squadron is dead and ncl will probably be a mess. Good players just leave to play in better leagues, without us getting decent transfer fees. The club can't even translate the massive football community into spectators. Even if you ignore the inept administration of the club, what am I missing about football that convinces you that the Jets have a rosy future?

Since I have NFI, I assume you have all the answers.

Yes firstly I do have ALL the answers

Secondly you still have NFI about supporting a football club.
It ain't about winning it ain't about losing

You just don't get IT

There is an IT that has just sailed straight over your plastic Fairweathered head

Could not give a **** how disorganised the Jets are
Could not give a **** how uneven the comp is

I still be there living the dream

Whilst you can go off chasing your glory completely clueless to anything

Jules
30-03-2017, 04:54 PM
Yes firstly I do have ALL the answers

Secondly you still have NFI about supporting a football club.
It ain't about winning it ain't about losing

You just don't get IT

There is an IT that has just sailed straight over your plastic Fairweathered head

Could not give a **** how disorganised the Jets are
Could not give a **** how uneven the comp is

I still be there living the dream

Whilst you can go off chasing your glory completely clueless to anything

Oh, okay, you meant I had NFI about supporting a club, not that I had NFI about football.

I really don't care about your opinion of whether I'm a proper supporter or not. But I do like to argue, which is why I raised this topic in a football forum. You get much better information debating people than talking to people who agree with you.

MFKS
30-03-2017, 05:14 PM
Oh, okay, you meant I had NFI about supporting a club, not that I had NFI about football.

I really don't care about your opinion of whether I'm a proper supporter or not. But I do like to argue, which is why I raised this topic in a football forum. You get much better information debating people than talking to people who agree with you.

Supporting a club and football

As I said you have no idea.

I still stand by that and I will call you on it.

You like to argue so you say......


Ok then

You want to actually discuss something other than your plastic view on football and your love in with a game of aerial ping pong for bogans??

Jules
30-03-2017, 05:41 PM
You want to actually discuss something other than your plastic view on football and your love in with a game of aerial ping pong for bogans??

Not really, and not with you. You haven't said anything of value yet and seem to know all about me from my 6 posts. Maybe if you actually said something other than that you don't give a shit how badly the club or league is run.

MFKS
30-03-2017, 05:45 PM
Not really, and not with you. You haven't said anything of value yet and seem to know all about me from my 6 posts. Maybe if you actually said something other than that you don't give a shit how badly the club or league is run.

I haven't said anything of value yet as you still haven't said anything of value.

No it didn't take me 6 posts to have you figured out 1 put me on the right track and 2 confirmed it.

So you don't want to discuss anything because you have little to offer.

No problem

furns
30-03-2017, 05:53 PM
AFL has been tried in areas other than the southern states - it doesn't work.
See Gold Coast, GWS, etc.
It took Brisbane & Sydney decades to get any type of foothold in those cities, some might argue that they haven't been roaring successes either as the crowds really only turn up in the run in to the finals.
Personally, AFL bores me to tears. And I can't see a game that's only popular in 3 states of one country on the planet expanding beyond that, regardless of ill-conceived games in China.

Footballs strength is its global reach. The professional game is only 12 years old in Australia, see how long it took the MLS & J-League to establish themselves in the modern era.

Jules
30-03-2017, 06:29 PM
And I can't see a game that's only popular in 3 states of one country on the planet expanding beyond that, regardless of ill-conceived games in China.

But the point is that you would never want it to expand beyond Australia. My experience following the Jets has made me see how low in the pecking order we are. We fail to attract real stars (the MLS and China has much higher purchasing power than us) and we lose our own valuable players way too quickly. If Aaron Mooy played AFL, he couldn't go anywhere. So you can happily invest in developing your players knowing that they will stay here for their entire career. I'm starting to see the international character of football as a disadvantage to being a supporter of a regional A-League club. It might be an advantage to a player, but not to a supporter.

I agree that no other football code has a strong foothold across the entire nation. But of the winter sports, which one looks most promising? It's not rugby league. AFL is in every major market except Canberra and the Hunter. It is ranked 4th in the world for average game attendance.

Football has the same problem with establishing a foothold in the Australian market. And the BBL is expanding its season next year. The move to Summer to avoid clashing with rival football codes is no longer an advantage. I have people in my street whose kids play soccer and they won't go to the Jets but they'll drive to Sydney for the BBL.

I'm not wishing for the death of the Jets or the A-League, I just don't think that the Jets are ever going to reach the heights they did in the first 3 seasons again. Ever. Con basically wrecked any chance of that. Any revival was reliant on the new owner basically tipping in unlimited funds to rejuvenate the club, but I can't see that happening.

Jules
30-03-2017, 06:43 PM
Footballs strength is its global reach.

I think it is also it's weakness. Like I said above, I was all caught up in the Johnny Warren mission to say "I told you so" but the corruption at FIFA put a permanent stain on that. What is the point of being part of a global community if it is a corrupt one. We have to live through a world cup going to Qatar!

Despite this, the idea for an AFL team in Newcastle (which is probably a 10 year project - realistically) and the population of the Hunter is set to head toward 1 million by 2050, has legs simply because it generates the most revenue of any domestic sport and is insulated from the international marketplace.

The only question for me is whether or not Newcastle and the Hunter would take to it, as we head toward 1 million people. We already have a local league and have produced players that have played in the AFL. It would be interesting to get some games up here and see what type of crowds were generated.

boz-monaut
30-03-2017, 07:18 PM
this thread is spam

user joins just to post about something that's totally irrelevant to this forum and to Newcastle

any reason why we shouldn't delete it?

plague
30-03-2017, 07:25 PM
this thread is spam

user joins just to post about something that's totally irrelevant to this forum and to Newcastle

any reason why we shouldn't delete it?


Because its working the Member up so much he's surely only a couple of posts away from a ban?

Jules is out here fishing and i think he's snagged one.

https://media1.giphy.com/media/3ornka9rAaKRA2Rkac/giphy.gif#1

MFKS
30-03-2017, 07:32 PM
Because its working the Member up so much he's surely only a couple of posts away from a ban?

Jules is out here fishing and i think he's snagged one.

https://media1.giphy.com/media/3ornka9rAaKRA2Rkac/giphy.gif#1

It ain't the politics thread

I in safe territory here dealing with him


Also if you think this bloke getting me worked up

Bloke is actually not even close to getting a half decent rise out of me.

He would have to have more intelligence than he does.

Aaron Mooy an elite AFL player wouldn't have to leave Australia. FMD

Of course that true. Because no other **** plays the ****ing game.

Just goes to show what a weak sport it is

You can get Gaelic Football players ,. Rugby players , illegal immigrants and turn them into elite level players quickly as skills required ain't that ****ing high

Jules
30-03-2017, 08:06 PM
this thread is spam

user joins just to post about something that's totally irrelevant to this forum and to Newcastle

any reason why we shouldn't delete it?

It's not spam. I used to be a regular poster but I don't want to use that username anymore because I'm ditching the Jets and I don't want the baggage of people knowing who I am carry over into this conversation. I've already proven I know Evo is a goalkeeper.

It's relevant because it is in the Sports Bar section and many people on this forum have experience in talking about the issues I'm raising with the Jets.

parksey
30-03-2017, 08:07 PM
Don't see why having an AFL club in Newy would mean the Jets had to fold. They could easily co-exist, like the Knights and Jets do.

The Knights would be the ones with the real fight on their hands; not that it would ever happen, as there's no real appetite for a pro Aussie rules club in the area - at all.

I like the sport but it will never be as big as football or league in Newcastle, never. And our city is a football heartland, no matter how shit the Jets are.

Grimario
30-03-2017, 08:08 PM
Member have you seen some of the dross that steals a living playing in the A League? That is our elite league here.


I'd love an AFL team here. Give be another club to be disappointed by.

Jules
30-03-2017, 08:15 PM
I'd love an AFL team here. Give be another club to be disappointed by.

That's my point though. I want a club that I'm not disappointed by. Knights are shit and I hate thugby culture. Not all rugby league fans are, but every low life in my area is a rugby league fan. I'm never going to support that team again.

I don't think an AFL team would compete with the Jets but a BBL team would. The only thing stopping a BBL team coming to Newcastle is that there is no venue.

Jules
30-03-2017, 08:24 PM
And our city is a football heartland, no matter how shit the Jets are.

I can't argue with that, but I think you'll see memberships fall below 5,000 next year. And many, many people who are turning away aren't likely to come back unless the club becomes very successful again. They've just lost interest. The thing that concerned me most is still the lack of corporate support, even with the new owner. Vacant corporate boxes is never a good sign.

plague
30-03-2017, 08:35 PM
the problem with the BBL is that it is an ongoing dilution of a sport that will eventually get 'boring' to its current audience.

yeah 20/20 is the business now (apparently) but so was 50 over before that and Shield Cricket before that.

Eventually there will be a 'super 15's or super 10's' spin off and eventually in the future 50,000 people will gather in a stadium to watch each team face one ball each them go home...........but man that one ball will be so freaking exciting.

Football has benefited from having a core set of rules/regulations that remain in place. the sport doesnt 'change' for the quick fix (thankfully the ****ing Yanks and their "bigger goals = more goals bullshit" didnt ever get off the ground).

AFL has done a similar thing with the whole 'super goal' concept getting mass pushback from coaches/players.

League has continually shot itself in the foot with rule changes/video interference that is always the biggest talking point after every game no matter what happens on field.

How many rules have changed in soccer in the last 50 years? backpass and maybe offside tinkering?

AFL is the biggest deal in the country, and is by far the best run sport. they will continue to strengthen while ever league and especially football are bogged down in their terrible governance.

I really like AFL, i don't have a team i just like the game. its a great time going to Melbourne for a big match, but like every sport, the bad can be downright awful.

Cant ever see an AFL team playing here. Newcastle would be so far down the pecking order.

Personally i think the City has done a great thing hitching itself to the V8 bandwagon. now theres a sport that knows what its doing.

MFKS
30-03-2017, 09:05 PM
It's not spam. I used to be a regular poster but I don't want to use that username anymore because I'm ditching the Jets and I don't want the baggage of people knowing who I am carry over into this conversation. I've already proven I know Evo is a goalkeeper.

It's relevant because it is in the Sports Bar section and many people on this forum have experience in talking about the issues I'm raising with the Jets.

So what you hiding??

You just sort of outed yourself as a multi

Why can't you post under your own name these views??

As for your other points about wanting a side to be proud of??

Besides being a plastic bandwagoner your also a condescending shit as well trying to break out some superiority compass

You seem to think that we don't want a club to be proud of do you??

You think the Knights fans don't want a club to be proud of do you??

The difference between Jets fans Knights fans etc and plastics like you is that we don't give up on our dream like you. We just view every trial and tribulation as part of the ****ing journey

When those special days come like Griff scoring the winning goal in the GF

Griff scoring the winner away v Gypos

Nobby knocking that last minute winner v Pissants the other month

The first win for Muppet against Adelaide

The Smurfs match where ADP and Heskey played and we killed them

Shit like that can't be replicated for you.

Why because we suffered for our triumph

So you just go clear out on us and go jump on whatever bandwagon you like never really understanding shit about anything

plague
30-03-2017, 09:40 PM
Why can't you post under your own name these views??


https://i.kinja-img.com/gawker-media/image/upload/s---C05Ea28--/hyefkqzxiymo0nsgw9jd.gif
https://i.kinja-img.com/gawker-media/image/upload/s--wnSxMWEg--/lfod0xnu3jcaw0skgwzn.gif
http://i.kinja-img.com/gawker-media/image/upload/s--PO0R9ntM--/1484170142680912713.gif
https://i.kinja-img.com/gawker-media/image/upload/s--DRy_arHQ--/c_scale,fl_progressive,q_80,w_800/d2uenuyuqyfg8izdsoax.gif

The Dunster
31-03-2017, 12:26 AM
Fair enough, but as a (former) Jets fan, I thought there might be some opinions at least. I simply can't see a future for the Jets. As a fan, I've been beating my head against a brick wall for the last 9 seasons. Then it dawned on me. The one thing that I've mocked rugby league and AFL for, the fact that it is not played in many countries, is actually an advantage. They can train a player knowing full well that he can't up an leave for more money overseas. They don't have to worry about a Andrew Hoole making unrealistic demands with threats to go to China. A global marketplace is actually a major disadvantage for a sport.

The promise of transfer fees in the A-League was just a pipe-dream.

I always thought that the A-League was the best alternative to thugby league culture, but now it seems like AFL might be the only way forward for our city.

You are 40 years too late for AFL. The game is structured within an inch of its life these days to the point whereby it's just dead ****ing boring to watch.
And players can up and leave AFL and they do to become NFL punters. Sure not a lot of opportunities but they do exist - and it's lucrative for those that make the grade.
AFL Players can also make decent Corner Backs as well and if they happen to have a little speed it's also possible they can become receivers [though unlikely given the speed requirements]

And the players these days are shit - no personality and boring as bat shit.

The Dunster
31-03-2017, 12:28 AM
the problem with the BBL is that it is an ongoing dilution of a sport that will eventually get 'boring' to its current audience.

yeah 20/20 is the business now (apparently) but so was 50 over before that and Shield Cricket before that.

Eventually there will be a 'super 15's or super 10's' spin off and eventually in the future 50,000 people will gather in a stadium to watch each team face one ball each them go home...........but man that one ball will be so freaking exciting.

Football has benefited from having a core set of rules/regulations that remain in place. the sport doesnt 'change' for the quick fix (thankfully the ****ing Yanks and their "bigger goals = more goals bullshit" didnt ever get off the ground).

AFL has done a similar thing with the whole 'super goal' concept getting mass pushback from coaches/players.

League has continually shot itself in the foot with rule changes/video interference that is always the biggest talking point after every game no matter what happens on field.

How many rules have changed in soccer in the last 50 years? backpass and maybe offside tinkering?

AFL is the biggest deal in the country, and is by far the best run sport. they will continue to strengthen while ever league and especially football are bogged down in their terrible governance.

I really like AFL, i don't have a team i just like the game. its a great time going to Melbourne for a big match, but like every sport, the bad can be downright awful.

Cant ever see an AFL team playing here. Newcastle would be so far down the pecking order.

Personally i think the City has done a great thing hitching itself to the V8 bandwagon. now theres a sport that knows what its doing.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rnso4nfdM9w

hawk
31-03-2017, 09:48 AM
AFL has been tried in areas other than the southern states - it doesn't work.
See Gold Coast, GWS, etc.
It took Brisbane & Sydney decades to get any type of foothold in those cities, some might argue that they haven't been roaring successes either as the crowds really only turn up in the run in to the finals.
Personally, AFL bores me to tears. And I can't see a game that's only popular in 3 states of one country on the planet expanding beyond that, regardless of ill-conceived games in China.

At least get it right. Afl is huge in Vic, SA, WA, Tas, NT.

NRbogan owns NSW, Qld and Maybe ACT.

Boring? pffft I'll leave that to basketball where if you're under 6' you're worthless. Outliers dont count for the tryhard argument.

hawk
31-03-2017, 10:10 AM
You are 40 years too late for AFL. The game is structured within an inch of its life these days to the point whereby it's just dead ****ing boring to watch.

Afl has just reinvented itself again this year. Formations and slight rule changes. All prof sports are highly engineered & in all facets.

Not sure how peeps see Afl as boring but each to own. I dont mind watching a bit of afl carn Carlton :( but I dont want to it overtake football here. All sports* for all but maybe football to somehow be the No1...#pipedream.


*cept 1, that one supports assholes of the world

Jetmaster
31-03-2017, 10:28 AM
because I'm ditching the Jets and I don't want the baggage of people knowing who I am carry over into this conversation

Sorry to offend - but that is keyboard warrior gutlessness.

I'm siding with the Member - if you say this truly, you are not passionate about football and are looking for another toy to play with. I have heard people at Jets games say they might follow SFC next year?! What you are saying is no different. YOU want to support a winning team - that is all.

I have watched the game for over 40 years - I have supported every Newcastle football club, supported the Socceroos before they became fashionable and support a downtrodden British club that never wins anything. Moments like 2005 and 2008 are what supporting a club is all about. If we don't make another WC or the Jets never win again I will always remember two of the great nights of my life.

You do not just toss your support aside - you moan, you argue, you curse everyone at your club - but you SUPPORT that club, especially if it is your local club.

Unfortunately this is the era of plasticity and you see Man City, Barcelona and Chelsea shirts that you would not have seen 10-15 years ago.

Finally, Newcastle as a city has bad form in getting behind its sporting flagships. The Jets and Knights are as powerful as anyone will get and they are on hard times as it is. AFL won't work - I have no problem with the game and am partial to Carlton, but their attitude is very "Brexit" - like our game or you are not Austrayan, it openly attacks the other codes and puffs its chest that it is bigger than it actually is.


I can't argue with that, but I think you'll see memberships fall below 5,000 next year. And many, many people who are turning away aren't likely to come back unless the club becomes very successful again. They've just lost interest. The thing that concerned me most is still the lack of corporate support, even with the new owner. Vacant corporate boxes is never a good sign.

Happened before and will happen again - and they DO comeback, they always do. The number of people I have met saying "never again" who still go to games. And many of our businesses are still getting to know the new regime. One of my businesses has a product relating to sports health. We are talking to Evergrande and if all goes well we will get into the corporate Jets bed. But it won't happen until those trust relationships are formed. I do know that Tinklers biggest mistake was not leveraging his businesses with the Chinese.

plague
31-03-2017, 11:16 AM
Man, some of you guys sure like being miserable huh.

Jules
31-03-2017, 12:09 PM
I'm siding with the Member - if you say this truly, you are not passionate about football and are looking for another toy to play with. I have heard people at Jets games say they might follow SFC next year?! What you are saying is no different. YOU want to support a winning team - that is all.

No, I'm not passionate about football, obviously. It's just a sport and I enjoyed it and the community atmosphere, but the community atmosphere around the Jets is toxic. After all this shit I would prefer to support a sustainable team and sport. I watched the Collingwood v Richmond game last night, and the corporate mainstream support through ground signage and television ads purely devoted to showing affinity to AFL were mindblowing. Despite the intentions, football has still been living in a sporting ghetto since 2005. It is a matter of opinion, but I don't think football will ever flip over into fully accepted mainstream in my lifetime. It is mainstream in Newcastle, but only in the community, not where the dollars are. The Jets would need to have a Man City like level of investment to drag corporate support across. I don't think it will happen with LEDMAN.

I think dumping the Jets to support Sydney FC is just ditching one piece of crap and replacing it with another one. It's not the same thing as walking away altogether. It is not about wanting support a winning team. It's actually looking at what I've been doing for the last 13 years and realising that its not going to get any better.



If we don't make another WC or the Jets never win again I will always remember two of the great nights of my life.

So will I.


You do not just toss your support aside - you moan, you argue, you curse everyone at your club - but you SUPPORT that club, especially if it is your local club.

That's your opinion, but what is it based on? The same people who say this, also say that there should be promotion and relegation to put pressure on clubs. Well, losing supporters also puts pressure on clubs to perform but they still don't take it seriously. It's not my fault they are a sack of shit. I gave every new ownership regime an opportunity to get their act together, this one included. i've seen nothing to indicate they actually understand what they're doing. Time's up.



Unfortunately this is the era of plasticity and you see Man City, Barcelona and Chelsea shirts that you would not have seen 10-15 years ago.

Yeah, you saw ManU and Liverpool shirts 10/15 years ago. Ask any Liverpool fan why they supported them over Everton, or Sheffield Wednesday. Could it have been because they were the most successful team in the 80s? Talk about hypocrisy. I've never supported a team because they were successful, i've supported them because something about them meant something to me. The Jets used to mean something but they've lost it.

There are things in life that you shouldn't walk away from, but a football team ain't one of them. That's just propaganda served up to keep dud teams going.

Jules
31-03-2017, 12:28 PM
Look, I like football. I just find these arguments a bit schizophrenic.

People argue that football is the World Game, and being part of something bigger is part of the attraction, yet AFL is the biggest party in Australia, and these same people don't want to be part of it. Our greatest event is Melbourne Victory coming to Newcastle. Everyone says "ho hum". We had a go at Asian Champions League and the people of the Hunter ignored it. I think it would be great to be part of a larger Australian community where teams like Collingwood and Richmond come here to compete.

People say you should be conservative about it "Stick to your team", all the while promoting a progressive, disruptive agenda, by trying to turn a sub-culture into a mainstream culture.

The whole premise for "I told you so", the formation of the FFA and the A-League was that it is a global game and so the force of globalism, the opportunities to engage with the world will pull Australia into line.

But there is also a case for Nationalism. When I go to the USA, do I want to see the Revolution play or do I want to see the Patriots, the Celtics, the Bruins or the Red Sox? When you go to Melbourne you almost feel like you are in a different country because AFL is so alien to us. But people who come to visit from other countries love it simply because it is different.

There are many reasons why football is a good sport, but those reasons also apply to AFL - plus you get to use your hands.

The Dunster
31-03-2017, 10:57 PM
Look, I like football. I just find these arguments a bit schizophrenic.

People argue that football is the World Game, and being part of something bigger is part of the attraction, yet AFL is the biggest party in Australia, and these same people don't want to be part of it. Our greatest event is Melbourne Victory coming to Newcastle. Everyone says "ho hum". We had a go at Asian Champions League and the people of the Hunter ignored it. I think it would be great to be part of a larger Australian community where teams like Collingwood and Richmond come here to compete.

People say you should be conservative about it "Stick to your team", all the while promoting a progressive, disruptive agenda, by trying to turn a sub-culture into a mainstream culture.

The whole premise for "I told you so", the formation of the FFA and the A-League was that it is a global game and so the force of globalism, the opportunities to engage with the world will pull Australia into line.

But there is also a case for Nationalism. When I go to the USA, do I want to see the Revolution play or do I want to see the Patriots, the Celtics, the Bruins or the Red Sox? When you go to Melbourne you almost feel like you are in a different country because AFL is so alien to us. But people who come to visit from other countries love it simply because it is different.

There are many reasons why football is a good sport, but those reasons also apply to AFL - plus you get to use your hands.

You don't get it.

AFL fans are loyal to their teams no matter where they are on the ladder. Your football teams having a few bad years and you jump ship.

Footscray / Bulldogs fans waited a long time for a premiership as did the Swans, Kangaroos, and magpies. Those premierships meant a lot more to those fans than they ever did to band wagoners like yourself who pull the pin when times are tough.

I grew up in Melbourne and have been a Hawks supporter all my life - I was at the 71, 76, and 78 Grand Final wins. I was also at the 1977 Pre lim loss to the Roos and the 1975 loss to the roos.

But I could rate at least ten Jets games as more memorable experiences. The AFC come from behind win, the win against the Roar to go into theseason 3 GF, beating Sydney at home in season 3 semi, beating the NZ Knights in season 2 for the teams first win. the 2nd season once we got on a roll.. the list is endless.
Sorry, but I've been to a shit load of AFL games over the past 50 years or so and it doesn't come close to what the Newcastle Jets and football are capable of delivering.

So what if the teams ****ed at the moment - That's just going to make it a whole lot better when things start going our way. And if they don't, then we always have the lols here on the foz.

Bremsstrahlung
31-03-2017, 11:09 PM
Yeah, you saw ManU and Liverpool shirts 10/15 years ago. Ask any Liverpool fan why they supported them over Everton, or Sheffield Wednesday. Could it have been because they were the most successful team in the 80s? Talk about hypocrisy. .

I've never seen Liverpool win a Premier League title. But give me Liverpool red over the dominant Man U, the invincibles of Arsenal, the money of Chelsea and City, the emergence of Tottenham any day.

I don't really know what this thread is even about. If it's proving Godwin's Law then Hitler will be happy.

MFKS
01-04-2017, 07:51 AM
Look, I like football. I just find these arguments a bit schizophrenic.

People argue that football is the World Game, and being part of something bigger is part of the attraction, yet AFL is the biggest party in Australia, and these same people don't want to be part of it. Our greatest event is Melbourne Victory coming to Newcastle. Everyone says "ho hum". We had a go at Asian Champions League and the people of the Hunter ignored it. I think it would be great to be part of a larger Australian community where teams like Collingwood and Richmond come here to compete.

People say you should be conservative about it "Stick to your team", all the while promoting a progressive, disruptive agenda, by trying to turn a sub-culture into a mainstream culture.

The whole premise for "I told you so", the formation of the FFA and the A-League was that it is a global game and so the force of globalism, the opportunities to engage with the world will pull Australia into line.

But there is also a case for Nationalism. When I go to the USA, do I want to see the Revolution play or do I want to see the Patriots, the Celtics, the Bruins or the Red Sox? When you go to Melbourne you almost feel like you are in a different country because AFL is so alien to us. But people who come to visit from other countries love it simply because it is different.

There are many reasons why football is a good sport, but those reasons also apply to AFL - plus you get to use your hands.

Ok then I have been and watched football in several countries on the planet.

When I there I can communicate with the locals about this game.

Try telling me about your experiences communicating with the locals about Tardball??


As for your point about Nationalism

Japan 2006
Uruguay 2005
Asian Cup Final 2015

These promote Nationalism better than anything NRL or AFL do.


What shits me most about these two codes is they try harping on the Nationalism card to promote their code and that some how you are less dinky di Aussie if you not follow Tardball or Drugy League.

State of Origin isn't the pinnacle of world sport like some would have us believe
Neither is winning the flag in Tardball

Also lets just remember what a joke of a sport Tardball is when come June and Messi and Neymar are in town and the poor sods are posing with Tardball players and a Sherrin with a bemused look on their face that says WTF


Small fry

baldrick
01-04-2017, 08:39 AM
For those saying AFL won't work in Newcastle, have you ever been to the F3 Twin servos before or then after a Swans game in Sydney ?

It's been pretty full of supporters wearing swan's gear when I've done the same.

Jules
01-04-2017, 10:21 AM
You don't get it.

AFL fans are loyal to their teams no matter where they are on the ladder. Your football teams having a few bad years and you jump ship

No, I'm not jumping ship simply because they've had a few bad years. I'm jumping ship because the entire premise under which the A-League was set up, that it was going to become a mainstream sport, is turning more and more into a fantasy. It is clear that the league is becoming uneven. The Jets don't have the corporate backing to compete, and they get ALL the dud time slots which shows that the FFA couldn't care less about ensuring a fair competition, so long as the money is coming in. This is a far cry from the fundamentals on which the league was founded. I'm not opposed to some teams naturally being stronger, but the FFA aren't going to help regional teams, with natural marketplace disadvantages, or even pretend to keep things as even as possible. And the Jets continually fail to take advantage of the thing that are in their favour, like lack of entertainment alternatives.

The sport needs to have mainstream support to be healthy. It is still anaemic after 13 years and you will probably see commercial channels pass on the free to air to rights again, because there just won't be enough opportunities to generate advertising revenue.

Good luck to you. I hope you get to experience more highs in the future. If Mr Lee comes to the party it might be sooner than later, but I won't lose any sleep over it.

Jules
01-04-2017, 10:52 AM
Good, you're actually making some solid points now MFKS, well done.




Try telling me about your experiences communicating with the locals about Tardball??



I've already told you in this thread. I worked with a lot of English people in Sydney and they loved AFL. They much preferred it to the NSL at the time, when Northern Spirit was in its prime. The reasons were many. Firstly, they came from the home of football, so our version wasn't anything special to them. Secondly, they appreciated what was good about the game, without any chip on their shoulder: because it is unique to Australia and they came here to experience our lifestyle, the action moves long distances quite quickly, the players are athletic and brave without being thuggish to the extent rugby league players are (and they were biased against the Northerners game anyway), there is a gradual progression to the score of the game, so while teams can certainly turn a game around, the rewards for effort are spread over the a greater span of time (sure, it doesn't shoot the dopamine up like a goal in football does but most sports are like this - cricket, baseball, every other type of football, basketball - it is only football that condenses scoring into a few microseconds per game).

I also love that it is just plain Aussie pragmatics that a country that loves cricket would create a sport that uses the same oval in winter.





As for your point about Nationalism

Japan 2006
Uruguay 2005
Asian Cup Final 2015

These promote Nationalism better than anything NRL or AFL do.

Well, I'm not sure I agree with you on this. It assumes, like Craig Foster argues, that we have to create a performance pyramid from children all the way up, to achieve those few, fleeting moments of national pride. And I've already mentioned that the corruption of FIFA, the Olympic Committee, basically any group that feels they can lord it over masses of population, does not sit well with me. We've been humiliated enough, through our World Cup bid, and bowing to the FIFA overlords over various other things. It has left a very sour taste in my mouth.

I've taken my kids through the football factory, as it's just becoming full of ego and career coaches who'd rather coach then deliver washing machines. Kids sport should be about fun but the football factory, with the national curriculum etc, is all geared toward international competition for the few elites that make it. I'm not saying that kids sport shouldn't focus on skill, of course it should, but what I see is beyond that. Half the coaches and parents are focused on the FFA ideology and half the coaches and parents just want kids to get exercise and have fun. But lets be clear, it is a top down ideology, not a grassroots up movement. Its a cultural imposition. So, is that really being Nationalist? Is having our kids free time dictated to by the Dutch methodology really Australian?

Cultural Nationalism is something that you should be able to feel every day. You shouldn't have to wait until you compete with another nation until you get a chance to experience it. In that respect, AFL is the only sport that makes the grade, because it is the only true Australian sport. Even cricket and the rugby codes come from England.

MFKS
01-04-2017, 11:34 AM
Good, you're actually making some solid points now MFKS, well done.



I've already told you in this thread. I worked with a lot of English people in Sydney and they loved AFL. They much preferred it to the NSL at the time, when Northern Spirit was in its prime. The reasons were many. Firstly, they came from the home of football, so our version wasn't anything special to them. Secondly, they appreciated what was good about the game, without any chip on their shoulder: because it is unique to Australia and they came here to experience our lifestyle, the action moves long distances quite quickly, the players are athletic and brave without being thuggish to the extent rugby league players are (and they were biased against the Northerners game anyway), there is a gradual progression to the score of the game, so while teams can certainly turn a game around, the rewards for effort are spread over the a greater span of time (sure, it doesn't shoot the dopamine up like a goal in football does but most sports are like this - cricket, baseball, every other type of football, basketball - it is only football that condenses scoring into a few microseconds per game).

I also love that it is just plain Aussie pragmatics that a country that loves cricket would create a sport that uses the same oval in winter.




Well, I'm not sure I agree with you on this. It assumes, like Craig Foster argues, that we have to create a performance pyramid from children all the way up, to achieve those few, fleeting moments of national pride. And I've already mentioned that the corruption of FIFA, the Olympic Committee, basically any group that feels they can lord it over masses of population, does not sit well with me. We've been humiliated enough, through our World Cup bid, and bowing to the FIFA overlords over various other things. It has left a very sour taste in my mouth.

I've taken my kids through the football factory, as it's just becoming full of ego and career coaches who'd rather coach then deliver washing machines. Kids sport should be about fun but the football factory, with the national curriculum etc, is all geared toward international competition for the few elites that make it. I'm not saying that kids sport shouldn't focus on skill, of course it should, but what I see is beyond that. Half the coaches and parents are focused on the FFA ideology and half the coaches and parents just want kids to get exercise and have fun. But lets be clear, it is a top down ideology, not a grassroots up movement. Its a cultural imposition. So, is that really being Nationalist? Is having our kids free time dictated to by the Dutch methodology really Australian?

Cultural Nationalism is something that you should be able to feel every day. You shouldn't have to wait until you compete with another nation until you get a chance to experience it. In that respect, AFL is the only sport that makes the grade, because it is the only true Australian sport. Even cricket and the rugby codes come from England.

Slow down

Your going off on 20 tangents a post

Stop putting it all in the one post and save a bit for later

Jules
01-04-2017, 11:45 AM
Slow down

Your going off on 20 tangents a post

Stop putting it all in the one post and save a bit for later

No, all of my "tangents" relate to the two points you chose to pick up on: Communicating with the "locals" about Tardball, and Nationalism. I'm not going off topic.

MFKS
01-04-2017, 11:46 AM
Since when did football having to be mainstream matter??

It doesn't matter to me.

To those that this does matter to well the reality is it was always going to take generations to occur

Drugby League and NRL have their little patch thanks to the free kicks the media has given them the last 40 years

As a result they are set for a while until the dinosaurs who love the games die off and also free to air tv reaches the graveyard

Add in the protectionist policies government have with the Anti Siphoning laws for live sport also giving the status quo more protection from up and coming sports

Also Football in this code won't go mainstream until we have a superstar.

I not talking about players like Kewell Viduka etc playing OS

I talking about when an Aussie is 1 of the top 10 players on the planet and is winning big trophies not as part of a side but as the Star

As soon as the Aussie superstar arrives Football will move quicker mainstream than ever before

Bremsstrahlung
01-04-2017, 03:39 PM
For those saying AFL won't work in Newcastle, have you ever been to the F3 Twin servos before or then after a Swans game in Sydney ?

It's been pretty full of supporters wearing swan's gear when I've done the same.

I've also seen it on a weekend, public holiday, school holidays.
Just like the Waratahs. They get a wide following because their 40,000 fans have one team to support.
Sure, there may be a few Newcastle fans of the swans, myself included, but I doubt Newcastle has a market for it. Any of you been to watch black diamond out of curiosity?
Idk, posting about the viability of an Afl team in a football forum won't generate an accurate depiction of what the community wants or would appreciate and support.

plague
02-04-2017, 01:25 PM
Idk, posting about the viability of an Afl team in a football forum won't generate an accurate depiction of what the community wants or would appreciate and support.

Most of the Foz doesn't even want a soccer team in Newy.

Jetmaster
05-04-2017, 03:02 PM
There are still hundreds of people that drive down the M1 each week to see "their" NRL team - Easts, Souths, Tigers, Manly et al.

Twin servos always look full after something in Sydney - on Sunday it will look crammed with Jets fans even though a few hundred go.

It's THE place to piss.

Jules
11-04-2017, 09:55 AM
I contacted the AFL to see what plans they had to expand into our region. The answer was that they are definitely interested long term, but for the time being our area "belongs" to the Sydney Swans and they are trying to work with Newcastle Council to upgrade a facility to the point where the Swans can host a community round game here.

The interesting thing I found was how approachable they are. When you send an email to the FFA, you pretty much get dismissed and rebuffed. You are fed with cliches like "Thanks for supporting our game" but nothing of substance. There was a genuine difference in the way they communicate.

Look, I'm not expecting anyone on here to "join the cause" but I would at least hope that football fans could see the AFL as something they could support in the winter while they support the Jets in the summer. I heard some football chants during the Freemantle broadcast so I'd say some Glory fans follow both teams, as would people in Melbourne and Adelaide.

I've watched as many games as I could over the last two weekends and I think the complaints about the game are unfounded. It's an exciting sport. None of the games I watched got bogged down in scraps for long periods. Packs do form simply because they can't get caught with the ball and so tend not to want to hold onto it when there are a lot of people around but the players these days try to clear them as quick as possible.

There actually seems to have been an evolution in the game since I was last interested in it, which was before the A-League started - there is more "soccerring" off the ground as a valid technique to clear rucks and to pass the ball to teammates, there is also a lot more strategy in rotating through the backline and going backwards at times to retain possession (although the commentators don't seem to like this very much). I'm not sure whether the evolution in football in Australia has any impact on Aussie rules but I think it would have because both are full field games and with no structured turnover of possession, techniques for using the field to retain possession will crossover to some extent. For example, Buddy Franklin did a superb cross from the left flank to give the Full Forward a mark. One commentator thought it was a miss-kick for goal but it proved to be a clear cross into the centre.

StannyCFCJET
11-04-2017, 10:04 AM
I contacted the AFL to see what plans they had to expand into our region. The answer was that they are definitely interested long term, but for the time being our area "belongs" to the Sydney Swans and they are trying to work with Newcastle Council to upgrade a facility to the point where the Swans can host a community round game here.

The interesting thing I found was how approachable they are. When you send an email to the FFA, you pretty much get dismissed and rebuffed. You are fed with cliches like "Thanks for supporting our game" but nothing of substance. There was a genuine difference in the way they communicate.

Look, I'm not expecting anyone on here to "join the cause" but I would at least hope that football fans could see the AFL as something they could support in the winter while they support the Jets in the summer. I heard some football chants during the Freemantle broadcast so I'd say some Glory fans follow both teams, as would people in Melbourne and Adelaide.

I've watched as many games as I could over the last two weekends and I think the complaints about the game are unfounded. It's an exciting sport. None of the games I watched got bogged down in scraps for long periods. Packs do form simply because they can't get caught with the ball and so tend not to want to hold onto it when there are a lot of people around but the players these days try to clear them as quick as possible.

There actually seems to have been an evolution in the game since I was last interested in it, which was before the A-League started - there is more "soccerring" off the ground as a valid technique to clear rucks and to pass the ball to teammates, there is also a lot more strategy in rotating through the backline and going backwards at times to retain possession (although the commentators don't seem to like this very much). I'm not sure whether the evolution in football in Australia has any impact on Aussie rules but I think it would have because both are full field games and with no structured turnover of possession, techniques for using the field to retain possession will crossover to some extent. For example, Buddy Franklin did a superb cross from the left flank to give the Full Forward a mark. One commentator thought it was a miss-kick for goal but it proved to be a clear cross into the centre.

Your still going on about this?? Go onto a Newcastle Afl forum if you want to gain newcastle support for AFL

hawk
11-04-2017, 10:14 AM
There actually seems to have been an evolution in the game since I was last interested in it, which was before the A-League started - there is more "soccerring" off the ground

That happened on a wet day, its rare and coaches dont like it. The local afl comp is in one of the lowest points in decades. Even combining with the cent coast hasnt helped and is flopping worse.

I watch the afl and quite like it but then ill watch any sport that has an even contest except cvntby league. Go Northstars.

on a grassroots level its football all the way.

Would i watch the afl Newcastle Storks? probs and be in the situation as Jets

The Dunster
11-04-2017, 11:42 AM
I contacted the AFL to see what plans they had to expand into our region. The answer was that they are definitely interested long term, but for the time being our area "belongs" to the Sydney Swans and they are trying to work with Newcastle Council to upgrade a facility to the point where the Swans can host a community round game here.

The interesting thing I found was how approachable they are. When you send an email to the FFA, you pretty much get dismissed and rebuffed. You are fed with cliches like "Thanks for supporting our game" but nothing of substance. There was a genuine difference in the way they communicate.

Look, I'm not expecting anyone on here to "join the cause" but I would at least hope that football fans could see the AFL as something they could support in the winter while they support the Jets in the summer. I heard some football chants during the Freemantle broadcast so I'd say some Glory fans follow both teams, as would people in Melbourne and Adelaide.

I've watched as many games as I could over the last two weekends and I think the complaints about the game are unfounded. It's an exciting sport. None of the games I watched got bogged down in scraps for long periods. Packs do form simply because they can't get caught with the ball and so tend not to want to hold onto it when there are a lot of people around but the players these days try to clear them as quick as possible.

There actually seems to have been an evolution in the game since I was last interested in it, which was before the A-League started - there is more "soccerring" off the ground as a valid technique to clear rucks and to pass the ball to teammates, there is also a lot more strategy in rotating through the backline and going backwards at times to retain possession (although the commentators don't seem to like this very much). I'm not sure whether the evolution in football in Australia has any impact on Aussie rules but I think it would have because both are full field games and with no structured turnover of possession, techniques for using the field to retain possession will crossover to some extent. For example, Buddy Franklin did a superb cross from the left flank to give the Full Forward a mark. One commentator thought it was a miss-kick for goal but it proved to be a clear cross into the centre.

The complaints about the game are well agreed upon by people who have been watching AFL for well over 50 years. The modern players are robots and they all do pretty much the same thing in that they follow a script / plan to the letter and never deviate from it. Then you have shit like flooding to add to the mix and the games not a patch on what it once was.

And Buddy Franklin is shit. Sorry but he's the most over-hyped forward in the history of the game. At best he's a big guy that can move a bit for a man of that size. But the job of a FF is too kick goals and he couldn't hit a barn door from 20m in front.

He would not have even gotten a run 30 years ago given that FF's back then could actually kick a ball between the sticks.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LxOljBVil2g

Jules
11-04-2017, 03:09 PM
Your still going on about this?? Go onto a Newcastle Afl forum if you want to gain newcastle support for AFL

Have you seen the other threads in Sports Bar?? They are about sports other than football and in a lot of cases people have positive and interesting opinions about them. Don't worry about where else I talk about it. I'm talking about it in a lot of different places.

The Dunster
11-04-2017, 03:52 PM
Have you seen the other threads in Sports Bar?? They are about sports other than football and in a lot of cases people have positive and interesting opinions about them. Don't worry about where else I talk about it. I'm talking about it in a lot of different places.

You are too late. AFL died years ago. The sorry excuse for a sport you are getting behind is what was left in the bucket after the real game was aborted. It's all about speed and strength now. There's pretty much no real skill left in the game. Beep tests and all other sorts of useless shit / criteria are used on kids these days to cull them before a ball has even been kicked, passed, or marked.

The AFL is little more than a bigger version of the emerging Jets program.

Jules
12-04-2017, 11:46 AM
You are too late. AFL died years ago. The sorry excuse for a sport you are getting behind is what was left in the bucket after the real game was aborted. It's all about speed and strength now. There's pretty much no real skill left in the game. Beep tests and all other sorts of useless shit / criteria are used on kids these days to cull them before a ball has even been kicked, passed, or marked.

The AFL is little more than a bigger version of the emerging Jets program.

The Jacko interview you posted was interesting and very amusing. I forgot how insane that guy is.

You can make that same argument about any professional sport. Rugby League is in the same boat, it's lost its personality in the Super League war. Football in Australia has never had a real personality yet. I regard Viduka as the greatest modern player we have produced and he hardly played in the NSL. You can argue that the A-League is a completely manufactured product. The marquee system has failed so far to hit its mark in attracting real personalities to the game in order to make an impact on and off the field. del Piero was the biggest coup but Sydney FC didn't take full advantage of his Italian charisma. Sydney FC managed the almost impossible. They rubbed all the Italian glitz and glamour off him and made him look like a suburban diving hack. There is only one thing keeping the A-League experiment afloat - the money from FoxSports. The FFA was hoping that Optus would provide some real competition to boost the value of the product, but they didn't come to the table. The foundations for AFL into the future are much, much stronger. They have shown with the development of the women's competition and AFLX that they can take the pioneering ideas that football in this country lead with and basically trump them with their mainstream clout.

Regarding the Aussie Rules specific issues such as flooding. Football has the same issues but to a greater extent. Parking the bus can kill off a game too. Only in football, we consider it smart tactics employed by managers to win a game. We say 0-0 draws can be an exciting contest. In Football, we say that the game goes through an evolution as new tactics are employed, achieve success and are copied. Then a master tactician comes up with a way to counter it, and the process continues. This is the so-called "beauty of the World game". But if this happens in AFL, it has killed the game?

It depends what you define as "real skill". Mark Jackson may define it as the individual ability of a tough Full Forward. But just as the interplay of Barcelona is exciting to watch, the ability of an AFL team to handball their way out of danger is also attractive to watch. I may not be a purist. I have drifted in and out of watching AFL over the years. I've played Aussie Rules and football. Troy Luff was only a couple of years above me at my club when I was playing, so we all took a lot of interest in the Swans at the time. And I followed the Swans quite closely when I lived in Sydney without becoming a hard core fan. There was just too much Newcastle in me to completely follow a Sydney team.

What my argument rests on is the relative positions of the sports in Australia. It is certain that football dominates grassroots. It is almost just as certain that in the last 12 years of trying, it has failed to translate that into mainstream support. And the main reason for this is that the A-League loses its best players overseas way too soon and gets them back way too late. When you see players like Hoole making stupid demands on the basis that if they are not accepted, he will head overseas, it seems like a structural problem. There are three things that AFL has that the A-League doesn't: a captured player market, massive crowds on a regular basis and massive corporate support. I am just starting to see that you need all three in order to dominate as a professional sport.

The Dunster
12-04-2017, 02:07 PM
The Jacko interview you posted was interesting and very amusing. I forgot how insane that guy is.

You can make that same argument about any professional sport. Rugby League is in the same boat, it's lost its personality in the Super League war. Football in Australia has never had a real personality yet. I regard Viduka as the greatest modern player we have produced and he hardly played in the NSL. You can argue that the A-League is a completely manufactured product. The marquee system has failed so far to hit its mark in attracting real personalities to the game in order to make an impact on and off the field. del Piero was the biggest coup but Sydney FC didn't take full advantage of his Italian charisma. Sydney FC managed the almost impossible. They rubbed all the Italian glitz and glamour off him and made him look like a suburban diving hack. There is only one thing keeping the A-League experiment afloat - the money from FoxSports. The FFA was hoping that Optus would provide some real competition to boost the value of the product, but they didn't come to the table. The foundations for AFL into the future are much, much stronger. They have shown with the development of the women's competition and AFLX that they can take the pioneering ideas that football in this country lead with and basically trump them with their mainstream clout.

Regarding the Aussie Rules specific issues such as flooding. Football has the same issues but to a greater extent. Parking the bus can kill off a game too. Only in football, we consider it smart tactics employed by managers to win a game. We say 0-0 draws can be an exciting contest. In Football, we say that the game goes through an evolution as new tactics are employed, achieve success and are copied. Then a master tactician comes up with a way to counter it, and the process continues. This is the so-called "beauty of the World game". But if this happens in AFL, it has killed the game?

It depends what you define as "real skill". Mark Jackson may define it as the individual ability of a tough Full Forward. But just as the interplay of Barcelona is exciting to watch, the ability of an AFL team to handball their way out of danger is also attractive to watch. I may not be a purist. I have drifted in and out of watching AFL over the years. I've played Aussie Rules and football. Troy Luff was only a couple of years above me at my club when I was playing, so we all took a lot of interest in the Swans at the time. And I followed the Swans quite closely when I lived in Sydney without becoming a hard core fan. There was just too much Newcastle in me to completely follow a Sydney team.

What my argument rests on is the relative positions of the sports in Australia. It is certain that football dominates grassroots. It is almost just as certain that in the last 12 years of trying, it has failed to translate that into mainstream support. And the main reason for this is that the A-League loses its best players overseas way too soon and gets them back way too late. When you see players like Hoole making stupid demands on the basis that if they are not accepted, he will head overseas, it seems like a structural problem. There are three things that AFL has that the A-League doesn't: a captured player market, massive crowds on a regular basis and massive corporate support. I am just starting to see that you need all three in order to dominate as a professional sport.

Mark Jackson is not insane. He's one of the most knowledgeable AFL people on the planet. With respect to corporate support it's deeper than that. The corporate types own the game now - it used to belong to the people.

Prior to big business getting involved crowds were bigger in the past than they are now allowing for changes in total population - perhaps even if you don't.

Players back then loved the game. Today's players only love what the game can buy them. The A-league players think much the same way.

Fortunately for me I don't need a sporting team to support to make my life complete so to speak. And I'm certainly not going to get involved with anything funded by grubby corporate money.

Jules
12-04-2017, 02:35 PM
Mark Jackson is not insane. He's one of the most knowledgeable AFL people on the planet. With respect to corporate support it's deeper than that. The corporate types own the game now - it used to belong to the people.

Prior to big business getting involved crowds were bigger in the past than they are now allowing for changes in total population - perhaps even if you don't.

Players back then loved the game. Today's players only love what the game can buy them. The A-league players think much the same way.

Fortunately for me I don't need a sporting team to support to make my life complete so to speak. And I'm certainly not going to get involved with anything funded by grubby corporate money.

I meant insane in terms of his behaviour. I agree that he smashed the interviewer in terms of knowledge of the game.

But aren't you involved in the A-League? My mistake if you aren't. Did the A-League ever belong to the people or was it formed with grubby corporate money? Not a single A-League club is member owned. Is FIFA not awash with grubby corporate money? Do the people run the FFA? I would even say that the rot in football has made its way to the grassroots, where the FFA mandated curriculum is implemented and 10 year olds talk about how much their football boots cost.

The problem is universal in professional sport so I don't think it can be used as an argument against one particular sport.

The Dunster
12-04-2017, 02:52 PM
I meant insane in terms of his behaviour. I agree that he smashed the interviewer in terms of knowledge of the game.

But aren't you involved in the A-League? My mistake if you aren't. Did the A-League ever belong to the people or was it formed with grubby corporate money? Not a single A-League club is member owned. Is FIFA not awash with grubby corporate money? Do the people run the FFA? I would even say that the rot in football has made its way to the grassroots, where the FFA mandated curriculum is implemented and 10 year olds talk about how much their football boots cost.

The problem is universal in professional sport so I don't think it can be used as an argument against one particular sport.

I'm not involved in the A-league beyond being a season ticket holder for 10 years or so. But I was a VFA and VFL member through the late 1960's, 70,s 80's, and beyond.

The very rot you talk about in the FFA / A-league to grass roots level is pretty much the AFL's blueprint. It's all successful to many people - to others it's a giant whorehouse.

It's beyong sport though - it's more to do with separation of ownership and corporate / manager types com-modifying everything into a dollar figure.

belchardo
22-07-2018, 04:17 PM
https://www.canberratimes.com.au/sport/afl/absolutely-disgusted-wild-brawl-erupts-after-geelong-melbourne-classic-20180722-p4zswl.html

you know, if there were almost 10 violent incidents in about 2/3rds of the a-league season, the Daily Telegraph and Herald Sun would be screaming about shutting the league down.

we'll see what they say about this...

plague
22-07-2018, 05:02 PM
https://www.canberratimes.com.au/sport/afl/absolutely-disgusted-wild-brawl-erupts-after-geelong-melbourne-classic-20180722-p4zswl.html

you know, if there were almost 10 violent incidents in about 2/3rds of the a-league season, the Daily Telegraph and Herald Sun would be screaming about shutting the league down.

we'll see what they say about this...

yeah while i agree with your point about the different reactions to the different sports, lets also not forget that the AFL doesnt have a group of mongs out there standing up for the fans behaviour like soccer does.

You think there will be any mass fan walkouts once they identify and ban the idiots in these videos? aint no one in Victoria standing up for those dudes.

380
22-07-2018, 06:42 PM
Similar incidents have taken place already this season with several at Crows home games.

Jetmaster
08-09-2018, 08:40 AM
Now street bashings taking place.....hools.

The Dunster
11-09-2018, 12:12 PM
I can remember punching on with opposition fans in the 1970's [Hawks, Blues, Roos, Pies]. Great times. Shame the on field action of those times hasn't been revived as well given how piss boring AFL has become in the last 30 years or so.

Bon
11-09-2018, 02:02 PM
I can remember punching on with opposition fans in the 1970's [Hawks, Blues, Roos, Pies]. Great times. Shame the on field action of those times hasn't been revived as well given how piss boring AFL has become in the last 30 years or so.

Was this before you became THE Dunster, and were getting to games as Super Dunster? :gent:

MFKS
11-09-2018, 06:16 PM
Might need to change thread title to Stadium Hoolz and Streetfighters thread

belchardo
29-09-2019, 11:36 AM
for those playing along at home, this is not a riot

https://www.news.com.au/sport/sports-life/swan-street-erupts-as-richmond-fans-revel-in-huge-grand-final-victory/news-story/18ce031e12e16691b7000fd7dcadd519

Bremsstrahlung
29-09-2019, 04:19 PM
What happened?
Did they recently start thea fights at every game?
Or have we just started hearing about it?

Jetmaster
29-09-2019, 04:38 PM
https://www.theage.com.au/sport/afl/police-bitten-headbutted-after-dozens-ejected-from-the-afl-grand-final-20190929-p52vvz.html

Letting off flares, headbutting women police officers and 43 evictions related to drugs and alcohol are just celebratory exuberance.....ffs.

boz-monaut
29-09-2019, 05:09 PM
these are just lovable larrikins letting off steam

plague
29-09-2019, 07:50 PM
these are just white people

fixed this for you.

plague
29-09-2019, 07:52 PM
Also:



Among the incidents, the father of GWS footballer Toby Greene has been charged with headbutting a female police officer.


Mr Greene was interviewed by police on Saturday night and charged with public drunkenness, assault emergency worker, resist police, intentionally cause injury, recklessly cause injury and committing an indictable offence while on bail.

https://media3.giphy.com/media/bkT0qkyhKwVMY/200.webp?cid=790b76113c09d486082c565587ccf9b521dba 768ba516b41&rid=200.webp


ummm, ok then.

Aegon
01-10-2019, 01:56 PM
Also:





https://media3.giphy.com/media/bkT0qkyhKwVMY/200.webp?cid=790b76113c09d486082c565587ccf9b521dba 768ba516b41&rid=200.webp


ummm, ok then.

All class......