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yeah.Quote:
Originally Posted by lquiquer
and if only Rosa Parks sat her damn butt up the back of the bus like she was supposed to we wouldn't have all this icky civil rights crap to deal with.
gadamnit, next thing all the gays and women will be wanting stuff too.
https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/pr...A=w316-h421-ncQuote:
Originally Posted by lquiquer
In the afl they've been ignoring it for at least 20years.
Nelson Mandela should have just sat in that prison and ignored it all too....
Ignoring this kind of shit only teaches the uneducated that their behavior is acceptable.
Sticks and stones I reckon...
When I was a kid at school back in the dark ages we had a lunchtime "sockah" comp with teams based on our heritage. Those teams were Italy, Greece, Yugoslavia, Australia and Indigenous. We didn't call them that - it was Wogs, Spicks, Yugos, Aussies and Abbos, names agreeable with all. The insults during those games would get you hauled before a court these days but not one soul ever took offence. I was once called a "fat gorilla" - what is the difference between that and being called an "ape"?
I agree we need to be tolerant but we are going too far to the other side......guys like Laurie Cunningham, Clyde Best, Paul Cannoville and Cyrill Regis went through far more hell than Goodes, just for being black. Nicer guys you could not meet. Now that indigenous footballers around the nation are coming up with "solidarity" gestures the divide is widening, not closing. I would not boo him but I do not like Goodes or agree with what he is doing - for some reason that makes me a "racist", which I know I am not.
perhaps Goodes recognises the hell those guys went through, is grateful for them doing that and wants to make sure that the next generation don't go through the hell that he had to go through, lesser though it is than of previous generations.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jetmaster
and as for making you a racist, well that would all depend on the reasons for your dislike. why do you not like him? what about him do you dislike? why do you disagree with what he is doing? and what do you think he is actually doing? I've not really had anybody explain to me yet what they have a problem with.
i understand this comparison - when you're all on the schoolyard together, for the most part everyone is equal. the shit flows around and no-one takes offence - but are you a wog, spick or an abo?Quote:
Originally Posted by Jetmaster
when you're off the yard - it's back to a completely different power dynamic. the wogs, the spicks and the abos for the most part are discriminated against compared to those who are in the dominant group.
those dealing out the epithets don't really get to decide what is racist and what isn't - it's the person on the receiving end of it.
i agree with you that you aren't a racist, and to paint everyone who's ever booed goodes as one is part of the problem here.
when you call people things, they don't like it - no-one likes being called a racist, especially if they aren't. quite similar to what goodes is going through now. he's not an ape, he's not a monkey - he's a bloke. just like you taking offence at being called racist, he has a right to take offence to being called an ape.
anyway not trying to give a lecture to you, everyone is their own person, and like you said - you can't just chuck people into the racist/non-racist buckets based on one situation - just throwing around ideas.
deary meQuote:
Originally Posted by MFKS
also re: sticks and stones...
this was collingwood's response to michael long calling out the fact monkhorst called him a black c*nt
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-OiW9e0jVHb...s_sRGB.800.jpg
unbelievable ay, this was 1995
bit from Barrie Cassidy's latest piece for the drum. http://www.abc.net.au/news/2015-07-3...goodes/6660554
well said.Quote:
The Adam Goodes matter is more disturbing because so many people don't get it; so many people insist it is the responsibility of Goodes and the Indigenous footballers to fix.
There is so much ignorance, intolerance and even blatant racism in the debate around whether it is OK to randomly boo Goodes every time he touches the football.
But let's take the short cut to most of that by detailing the rantings of former A League goalkeeper, Griffin McMaster, who created a Twitter storm when he suggested that because Goodes called Australia Day, Invasion Day, he should be deported.
It's not clear precisely where he should be deported to, but we'll carry on.
McMaster now works in the media and has contributed to the football magazine, FourFourTwo. Its editor, Kevin Airs, demanded McMaster remove any reference to the magazine from his biography.
This is how the Twitter conversation went after that.
McMaster: "No problems Kevin."When you boo, remember that's the calibre of those who join you.
Airs: "That is an incredibly stupid and ignorant tweet Griffin. I'm disappointed anyone in football would think like that."
McMaster: "Disrespect his country and you cop it. I'm not happy with the way he's going about things."
Airs: "His family have been here 40,000 years. If you don't like it, you leave. He's not dissing his country. He's proud of it."
McMaster: "Australian government bend over for indigenous. Free interest loans, free uni degrees. Even said sorry and he's still going on."
Airs: "He's not 'going on'. He's playing AFL and celebrating when he scores."
McMaster: "He doesn't celebrate Australia Day. Un-Australian ... that's why I'm not happy."
Let's hope Goodes has the courage for one more statement. Play again, if only once. To walk away now would leave this issue unresolved, forever staining the game.
An orchestrated roar of support the next time Goodes touches the ball - from thousands of supporters opposed to the Swans - will start to right this appalling episode.
If that doesn't happen, he will leave the game a shattered man. And thousands might leave with him.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q3Lu...layer_embedded
He knew sfa when it came to economics but when it comes to beating down John Howard nobody does it better.
is that supposed to be a dummy? unbeleivable.....Quote:
Originally Posted by q-money
Serious thought if this was printed on the ISIS flag and tattooed on everyone's shoulder where thier Southern Cross ink is the world would be a much better place,Quote:
Originally Posted by q-money
Genuinely curious:
How do we know the boo's from the crowd are actually racist? ( i feel we will have a better idea after this round)
Like fair enough, he's had some incidents that revolve around race, but there's also an argument going around that it's due to his playing style e.g. AFL's equivalent of diving for free kicks/being soft/in the refs ear.
(Don't get me wrong, i'm against the boo's if in fact they are due to him standing up for his race/heritage/ancestors/fellow indigenous, but if they are purely directed at him and his football antics, fair game). I know there's probably some people boo-ing him for the former, and some booing for the latter, but part of the problem is that he is labelling them all as one. So if you are booing him as he's one of the swans best players/dives/gets free kicks, and Goodes comes out and says the boos are racist. Then this becomes a grey area. It's like Hutcho coming out and saying he's sad that people boo him, and then says they are booing because he's maltese. Or Sterling blaming the boo's he received in Melbourne on race. It is an important issue, and he's not the first player to react.
Balotelli, Frimpong (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SdTRAh0XDJw) and numerous other footballers have reacted to racist slurs/chant/actions and have consequently been boo-ed and jeered as a result.
We will see what happens this weekend with Goodes (if he plays). After the AFL, AFL Captains and all the media, other sports have urged fans not to boo him as he believes it is racist and he is being affected by this, it will be interesting to see the reaction he gets.
Do these statements therefore make those that boo a racist for consciously booing (which is now associated with racist stigma)?
Either way, i think it would be really nice to see some universal cheers/applause when he gets the ball. I think that would seriously be the best move for all involved.
The majority (I hope) are not booing because he is aboriginal and he has climbed out of his box. I think most are just joining in the "mob mentality", what is scary about this though is there is obviously a critical mass of racist fans who are large enough to get enough of the crowd to do it too that this becomes an issue.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bremsstrahlung
Those booing just because it's what fans now do to Adam are now providing a smoke screen for the racists, protection almost for them.
Check out the link Gaz posted a couple of posts up. Then check out the video clip of Waleed Aly on the The Project who went through the whole situation with the 13 yr old girl.Quote:
Originally Posted by MFKS
Then realize you are completely and utterly wrong.
Ross Lyon the grub and his stupid generalist comments that arent needed to further stir the pot. Weve all booed someone more than once.
It's been well-documented in the past few days on social media, in blogs, newspaper articles that after the ape calling incident with the 13 year old girl that the girl apologised to him and also wrote a letter to him, he did not wish to press charges and made it clear it was not her fault and that he explained to her why it is offensive to him to be called an ape. The situation was dealt with admirably by Goodes and should never have re-surfaced.Quote:
Originally Posted by furns
Those saying there is nothing wrong with getting booed at constantly game after game, or being called an ape, a gorilla or a black c*&^t are basically talking shit and should just once think what it would be like to be in this man's shoes. Growing up and having to put up with racist jibes and now as an Australian of the Year and someone who has taken a stand so that others might not have to put up with the same rubbish, he has now been hounded practically out of the game by a seething, uneducated mob who don't like what he stands for and want him to shut up and be a good little abbo.
The reaction yesterday in Sydney though was very encouraging and shows that maybe the tide could be turning, that enough is enough. Goodes is a good, decent man, he has not assaulted anyone, or raped a woman, done drugs, been caught DUI like a lot of AFL or NRL players who have but are seemingly quickly forgiven and everyone gets on with life. He does not deserve to be targeted and humiliated at every away match like he is some arsehole.
Some interesting points but I have read somewhere that it is a myth about him "milking penalties", that for someone who is supposedly good at doing it he has actually received a very low amount of penalties from referees over the years. You see the mob mentality will make up anything to justify their actions for singling out a player, some say it is because of the 13 year old girl, others his outspokenness but why hound the guy for the whole game???Quote:
Originally Posted by Bremsstrahlung
The comparison with Hutch is like chalk and cheese, yes Jets supporters gave him a hard time over the years but I don't think other supporters dished it out to him. I think he actually enjoyed the attention but I don't think I ever heard someone yell "go back home ya wog".....in reference to his Maltese heritage. Goodes just last week was told "go back to the zoo", big difference being booed or heckled and then a racist slur being aimed at you.
There is no comparison in Australian sport history what Goodes has endured throughout this season so please stop trying to make comparisons or say there are grey areas because it is pretty well "black and white"....pardon the pun!
What makes you think I wish to listen to a word from that hypocritical beyond reproach leftist stooge??Quote:
Originally Posted by furns
That bloke has nothing to say that isn't propaganda for a cause
For sure Labi would have :lulz:Quote:
Originally Posted by stopper2
Well there you go, bronwyn bishop resigned. Probably because she was distracting people from shorten rather than she feels she's done anything wrong.
Lol. Me or waleed?Quote:
Originally Posted by MFKS
Yep.Quote:
Originally Posted by belchardo
lets just hope she's set a precedent and anyone else busted for the same stuff also fall on their sword.
It will wipe them out quicker than the virus in World War Z.
Distracting people from shorten?
My concern is what was going on that she really was distracting us all from.
Shorten is a complete waste of space like the rest of his party. Best thing Labour could do would be to phone the electoral office and ask that they be deregistered by the close of business Monday.
ok, i haven't been up to date as of late.
but.
i hear the comrades are adopting big Scotty Moz's boat policy, but the Greens are against it.
are the Greens and Labor a coalition? (i was under the assumption that the 2 party pref poll was based on Lab/Grn alliance).
Has anyone asked the question if they will go to the election with a united stance on this policy or will it be carbon tax part 2?
That's why politics has become a joke in this country. The Abbott Government is probably the worst in history but the alternative is not much better. If there was a truly viable 3rd choice, I reckon most Aussies would give them a go because neither the LNP coalition or Labour inspire any sort of confidence that they have a vision for the future of this country.Quote:
Originally Posted by The Dunster
PUP is the logical choice.Quote:
Originally Posted by stopper2
and what do you base this assumption on?Quote:
Originally Posted by stopper2
Waleed if I wasn't clear enoughQuote:
Originally Posted by GazFish35
See, I don't believe that Waleed Aly 'totally nailed it' either.
Firstly he implied the booing (and racism) began with the war dance, when in fact it had been going on for a few weeks prior.
Everyone keeps talking about 'minorities' in this discussion.
The only 'minority' that should be singled out is the .1% of the population booing Goodes. The other 99.9% of Aussies either support him or don't care enough to get involved. But the first sign of a minuscule percentage of 'us' doing the wrong thing means the usual fart sniffers jump to the old 'see, all da whities is raycess' line.
Single out the booers, shame them and hopefully they see the error of thier ways. It worked with the 13 yr old chick apparently.
Blokes like him and Rebecca Wilson just want to stare down the TV and say 'see, this is YOUR fault'.
No, it's the people booing Goodes. That's who's fault it is. Find them and it goes away.
Continue to lump your average Joe into the same group and you're gonna get pushback.
By their very own drunken sailor criteria for spending the current government are a failure.Quote:
Originally Posted by plague
Government spending as a percentage of GDP is higher under Abbott than it was under any labour government back to and including Whitlam.
Oddly enough, it is this very spending that is keeping the country from falling down the shitter.
The problem with any of these parties is their ideolgical / religous beliefs are far stronger than any commitment they have to the science behind their decisions or indeed any facts that might get in the way.
Yeah I'd say you could go back and find some economic category that statistically a particular govt would be poorly rated on.Quote:
Originally Posted by The Dunster
You'd be able to prob find social policy failures from each one as well.
Let alone foreign policy disasters/failings.
It just intrigues me when someone is adamant that one in particular is "the worst".
Like saying which coastie is the biggest **** innit?
You must hate the African Cup of Nations then...Quote:
Originally Posted by lquiquer
Hey man, don't forget about all those people hating on the Haka.Quote:
Originally Posted by WolfMan
They even do the throat slitting gesture and everyone is cool with it.
But Goodes, yep it's def the war dance that has earned him all this hate.
No vision at all for the futureQuote:
Originally Posted by plague
Selling our land off to overseas interests
Selling our jobs off to overseas interests
etc etc I could go on but I'll give an example of a guy I know who is a Manager for a company involved in the Manufacturing industry.
During the years of the Gillard government he absolutley despised her and was ecstatic when she got shafted and then Rudd was ousted.
Now under Abbott he says that WE ARE WORSE OFF and he is totally despondent with the way this country is heading....need I say anymore!
oh man, I've numbered these so we can go through them one by one.Quote:
Originally Posted by stopper2
1. No vision? As opposed to the land of milk and honey we've been on track for for the past 115 years? You may come to find that Pollies are awesome at 'saying' they are gonna do something and actually going through with it. (i.e they are all full of shit).
2. OK dude, you may want to go back and look at who actually owns all this prime farming land that is getting sold off. You might find an overwhelming % is privately owned (i.e farming folks and private companies). They have decided to take the best offer they can for their assets. I can only imagine you would be sweet when you are selling your house that the Govt came in and made you take less (or not be allowed to sell it) despite someone offering you over the odds. Yep, I'm sure you'd be all like "yeah cool cool ill take the financial hit TO KEEP DEM DARN CHINESE OUT OF OUR SUBURBS GADAMNIT".
3. The jobs you speak of are generally in the manufacturing industry yeah? cool, well then go look at Your car, fridge, tv, phone, clothes etc etc etc. The jobs aren't going anywhere because of the govt, they are going OS because people like you and me buy shit cause its cheaper to get it from OS. you want tariffs back? protectionist policies. dear oh dear, lets just build Donald Trumps wall and be done with it. dang foreigners.
4. OK, so one dude out of a population of 24 odd million is not a good sample size. but anyway, can you define the term "better off". because people equate that with cash in hand at the end of every week. try factoring in health care, national security, your retirement, roads, environment, education etc etc etc. just cause its not in your hand every week doesn't mean its not being spent on you.
im ok with your generalisations but seriously dude, think a bit more about the way the world works before spouting nonsense like this. to act like none of this isn't our fault is naive.
1. Governments vision is whatever the top 1% of wealth holders tell them it is.Quote:
Originally Posted by plague
2. You are forgetting that groups succesfully lobbied the Howard administration for changes to super and the like which artificially doubled the prices of land / houses overnight.
3. The models of free trade are little more than text book wankery. Once you introduce money, uncertainty, product differentiation, and finite supply and demand constraints things aren't quite so cherry. You are arguing against tarriffs from a perspective where tarrifs are what lined the pockets of those currently praising free trade.
If the world ran like a textbook than certainly free trade with nil tariffs would be the way to go - but that's not how the world works.
4. I would determine life expectancy as the best guide to peoples well being. Many, many indexes of human well-being exist with varying degrees of relevance.
Currently governments are not spending enough on healthcare, jobs... and so on.
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Dunster
2. Increased house prices were great for sellers, bad for buyers. Great for govt with increased revenues from stamp duty, good for people wanting to use equity to fund investments.
No one is forcing anyone to fork over $1/2 million for a one bedder in Iso. You want to snap up cheap real estate, do your homework, change your expectations. Whinging ain't gonna lower those prices.
Tariffs are great for some, bad for others.
Heck, there's even a helicopter company out there who think that Pollies abusing their travel allowances is great.
People crying at pollies for spending $5k on a helicopter ride won't bat an eyelid at spending $20b of 'their' money on submarines regardless of the price we can get them for elsewhere.
(Selective outrage just makes me giggle).
My gripe is that people who think that every government policy should be beneficial to everyone are delusional.
4. This is probably the best answer to this question I've ever heard. Cheers.
I don't have a problem with Bronwyn Bishop spending 5k on a helicopter ride.
The spending adds to aggregate demand and via a multiplier effect incomes increase.
What I do have a problem with is Bronwyn Bishop preaching about the importance of reduced spending here and there - without even the most basic understanding of the economics behind her ideological ramblings.