The A-League Expansion Thread

[belchardo]

I’m selfish. My interest in the a league would drop significantly without a Newcastle team.
Though, working in Sydney, I’d probably get along to the odd game, but nowhere near as invested (or tortured) as I am
now.

I think a second tier serves a purpose. But I just can’t see any current a league club being able to survive in the second tier.
Australians simply don’t follow or appreciate 2nd best. It’s a great means to promote clubs. But I dare say any team relegated would cease to exist and realistically not stand a chance at promotion. While we still have overseas owners and groups bankrolling our clubs, there will be minimal interest in finding a second tier team when you could be wasting your money on a top tier team.

Players aren’t going to “drop back” to help their club gain promotion. Signing and holding players to multi year contracts won’t be viable in a second tier. End up with Vargas and Dimi playing 2nd tier? I doubt it.

The top 10 teams or however many in the top division will simply continue to rearrange the top 200 players in the country. Same shit, different clubs.

by way of counterpoint, newcastle (in both league and football) have been performing pretty poorly for a number of season. Good players have been signed and then moved on to rival clubs. administratively, they have both been pants for some time.

and yet, they are both still in the comp, and receive some of the best support in their respective leagues. doesn't that imply a baseline level of interest that is sufficient to support the club to a reasonable extent (i accept that they have been bankrolled by large backers who have probably lost a lot of money)?

i sort of think a second tier comp would serve us well. we drop down, leave macdonald jones stadium, move to a smaller ground, get our stuff sorted out and then make a charge for the top tier again, fill the stands and look great to potential investors. the important thing would be to stay in the smaller ground once we move back up. 15,000 seat stadium would be great. then have games at MJS when we are routinely turning 5K away at the door.

a lower level would also make the potential buy in price lower for owners.

i think we would survive relegation. and wouldn't it be all that much sweeter when we win the (top flight) comp knowing what we've done to get there?

[MFKS]

I’m selfish. My interest in the a league would drop significantly without a Newcastle team.
Though, working in Sydney, I’d probably get along to the odd game, but nowhere near as invested (or tortured) as I am
now.

I think a second tier serves a purpose. But I just can’t see any current a league club being able to survive in the second tier.
Australians simply don’t follow or appreciate 2nd best. It’s a great means to promote clubs. But I dare say any team relegated would cease to exist and realistically not stand a chance at promotion. While we still have overseas owners and groups bankrolling our clubs, there will be minimal interest in finding a second tier team when you could be wasting your money on a top tier team.

Players aren’t going to “drop back” to help their club gain promotion. Signing and holding players to multi year contracts won’t be viable in a second tier. End up with Vargas and Dimi playing 2nd tier? I doubt it.

The top 10 teams or however many in the top division will simply continue to rearrange the top 200 players in the country. Same shit, different clubs.

If a current HAL club cant survive being relegated then it actually shows how fundamentally flawed the set up of the clubs are

For all the shit people like to put on the Old NSL clubs

South Melbpurne Sydney Olympic Melbourne Croatia Marconi etc

They are sill actually surviving being outside the top flight

They dont even have an avenue back either

If our crowds drop to 3/4k in a second tier .So what less plastics and we go play in an appropriate size stadium

Everyone seems to be fearful of a 2nd tier and says the costs are too high

Dont forget most of these top NPL clubs are running budgets of 400/500k a year now

[plague]

by way of counterpoint, newcastle (in both league and football) have been performing pretty poorly for a number of season. Good players have been signed and then moved on to rival clubs. administratively, they have both been pants for some time.

and yet, they are both still in the comp, and receive some of the best support in their respective leagues. doesn't that imply a baseline level of interest that is sufficient to support the club to a reasonable extent (i accept that they have been bankrolled by large backers who have probably lost a lot of money)?

i sort of think a second tier comp would serve us well. we drop down, leave macdonald jones stadium, move to a smaller ground, get our stuff sorted out and then make a charge for the top tier again, fill the stands and look great to potential investors. the important thing would be to stay in the smaller ground once we move back up. 15,000 seat stadium would be great. then have games at MJS when we are routinely turning 5K away at the door.

a lower level would also make the potential buy in price lower for owners.

i think we would survive relegation. and wouldn't it be all that much sweeter when we win the (top flight) comp knowing what we've done to get there?

this is a very good slant on pro/rel.
im gonna pin this on one of my vanity mirrors for the inevitable day when we end up there.

[Jetmaster]

If Fox want a Syd/Mel based league they can provide parachute payments to the the others as they get pushed out with unfair draws and the overall Beathness of refereeing.

[The Dunster]

by way of counterpoint, newcastle (in both league and football) have been performing pretty poorly for a number of season. Good players have been signed and then moved on to rival clubs. administratively, they have both been pants for some time.

and yet, they are both still in the comp, and receive some of the best support in their respective leagues. doesn't that imply a baseline level of interest that is sufficient to support the club to a reasonable extent (i accept that they have been bankrolled by large backers who have probably lost a lot of money)?

i sort of think a second tier comp would serve us well. we drop down, leave macdonald jones stadium, move to a smaller ground, get our stuff sorted out and then make a charge for the top tier again, fill the stands and look great to potential investors. the important thing would be to stay in the smaller ground once we move back up. 15,000 seat stadium would be great. then have games at MJS when we are routinely turning 5K away at the door.

a lower level would also make the potential buy in price lower for owners.

i think we would survive relegation. and wouldn't it be all that much sweeter when we win the (top flight) comp knowing what we've done to get there?

Nobody "INVESTS" in football - you basically toss your money into a bottomless pit with little to no chance of ever making a profit.

I think donate is a more appropriate term to use.

Your proposal here is extremely high risk with little to no chance of positive return either financially or subjectively.

I've seen it fail first hand with my old NSL club, and in other sports like league where Glebe, Newtown, and others have failed to ever recover after going down a division.

[Jetmaster]

Newcastle is one place that can come back given the shit we've been through over the last 40 years. We once got relegated from the NSL after finishing 5th.
We like being treated like dirt and coming back for more.
I still truly believe that if we had Mel/Syd type backing and consistent results we would be the second biggest club in the country after MV.

[The Dunster]

The Newcastle Rebels finished 4th and were knocked out by South Sydney in the semi finals.
South Sydney went on to win the grand final having only lost one game all season - and Newcastle were the team that beat them.
Newcastle were replaced by Annandale in the 1909 comp - and Newcastle players either went to or back to Union or joined the local league competition.

it took another 79 years before Newcastle had a team in the top tier competition.

This is why I wouldn't want to see any Newcastle side enter a 2nd tier.

[MFKS]

The Newcastle Rebels finished 4th and were knocked out by South Sydney in the semi finals.
South Sydney went on to win the grand final having only lost one game all season - and Newcastle were the team that beat them.
Newcastle were replaced by Annandale in the 1909 comp - and Newcastle players either went to or back to Union or joined the local league competition.

it took another 79 years before Newcastle had a team in the top tier competition.

This is why I wouldn't want to see any Newcastle side enter a 2nd tier.

It took Oz 32 years to get back to a WC

And how was the pain in 97 and 2001 etc and then the joy that night in November 2005??

No one is entitled to shit least of all us

Football needs to go pro rel as it is the defining quality that can set us apart from all sport in Oz

Anyone can make the top flight if you wotk hard enough

Southy West Wallsend Edgy any of them

Lets have an open model and allow innovation and ambition in Oz Football

[The Dunster]

It took Oz 32 years to get back to a WC

And how was the pain in 97 and 2001 etc and then the joy that night in November 2005??

No one is entitled to shit least of all us

Football needs to go pro rel as it is the defining quality that can set us apart from all sport in Oz

Anyone can make the top flight if you wotk hard enough

Southy West Wallsend Edgy any of them

Lets have an open model and allow innovation and ambition in Oz Football

Anarcho-capitalism is not a path I'd want to follow because for every success story you get a long list of casualties that never recover.
That's fine in some pursuits but in this case we are talking about community clubs with junior teams as well.
The risk filters all the way through a club - it just doesn't automatically stop at the senior side.
Losses won't mean going back and starting again - they probably mean game over yer finished.

We got back into a WC because had a golden generation of players and met an opponent grossly underfunded and decimated by injuries.
Since then, we have been given passage via an easier draw.
Regulation is what got us into World Cups not free markets.

[MFKS]

Anarcho-capitalism is not a path I'd want to follow because for every success story you get a long list of casualties that never recover.
That's fine in some pursuits but in this case we are talking about community clubs with junior teams as well.
The risk filters all the way through a club - it just doesn't automatically stop at the senior side.
Losses won't mean going back and starting again - they probably mean game over yer finished.

We got back into a WC because had a golden generation of players and met an opponent grossly underfunded and decimated by injuries.
Since then, we have been given passage via an easier draw.
Regulation is what got us into World Cups not free markets.

Capitalism is how football all over the planet works

Going to a capitalism model will see many great things

Wages reduced to appropriate levels
Opportunity for all
Realistic Costs

Then the market can regulate

This falsely creasted Communist league we have is broken because of its inherent structural limitations

If clubs go belly.up under a new model it no different than Con Tinkler Fury NZ Knights and every other failed cllub whether in Oz or O/S


Time to take the training wheels off our game and sink or swim

[plague]

Anarcho-capitalism

What does a fear of spiders have to do with football mate?

[Jeterpool]

What does a fear of spiders have to do with football mate?

Guus got it vs Uruguay with Kalac, mate.

[Couscous]

... Glebe, Newtown, and others have failed to ever recover after going down a division.

Yet Newtown lives on in our culture. Indeed it's experiencing a revival, thanks in part to The Teacher's Pet podcast and its investigation of a former Jets player.

[The Dunster]

Capitalism is how football all over the planet works

Going to a capitalism model will see many great things

Wages reduced to appropriate levels
Opportunity for all
Realistic Costs

Then the market can regulate

This falsely creasted Communist league we have is broken because of its inherent structural limitations

If clubs go belly.up under a new model it no different than Con Tinkler Fury NZ Knights and every other failed cllub whether in Oz or O/S


Time to take the training wheels off our game and sink or swim

You do realise that the Spanish government has been bankrolling Real Madrid and Barcelona for years.
Not only in the form of tax breaks specific to them and a few other select clubs but also with respect to gifting them state sponsored aid as well.

[plague]

Guus got it vs Uruguay with Kalac, mate.

As soon as I hit 'post' I sat with fingers crossed that someone would go there. And you did. Well in (as always) son.

[MFKS]

You do realise that the Spanish government has been bankrolling Real Madrid and Barcelona for years.
Not only in the form of tax breaks specific to them and a few other select clubs but also with respect to gifting them state sponsored aid as well.

So a couple of exampled where government helps clubs are just that a couple

Reality is regardless of whether it is the NBN here in Newy or the EPL club football 8s capitalism in nature every where

Yet for some reason our cunce of an FFA wont let us have it at HAL level as they want to use this communist model to restrict entrance into the comp and to protect the extortion PFA do with non market value salaries found in the HAL

[The Dunster]

So a couple of exampled where government helps clubs are just that a couple

Reality is regardless of whether it is the NBN here in Newy or the EPL club football 8s capitalism in nature every where

Yet for some reason our cunce of an FFA wont let us have it at HAL level as they want to use this communist model to restrict entrance into the comp and to protect the extortion PFA do with non market value salaries found in the HAL

Can you name an owner of a major football club anywhere in the world that's not a socialist ? I can't think of any.
The main reason is that in a free market environment long run profits equal zero.
I can't imagine the rich wanting to sign up to be a member of that system.

[turbojetfireV8]

Saw this one on FB
https://www.austfootball.com/a-leagu...in-new-zealand

[belchardo]

Saw this one on FB
https://www.austfootball.com/a-leagu...in-new-zealand

comedy gold. no thanks, we'll have expansion in australia thanks.

[plague]

Saw this one on FB
https://www.austfootball.com/a-leagu...in-new-zealand

Double Eff Aye already announced that the 2nd New Zealand team will be based in either Sydney or Melbourne.