FFA silliness: The protests and boycotts thread

[MFKS]

Member, no denying there is an element in particular the RBB and NT that are doing the game or their clubs no favours and they either need to tone down their act or just piss off away from the A league.
Okay you are saying that the overzealous security has nothing to do with the FFA but fans have been complaining for a while now about this issue at games, shouldn't the FFA as the governing body try to address this with security, clubs and supporter groups and try to solve the issue, rather than let it come to head where we are now seeing boycotts.
What you have mentioned with your own experiences unfortunately doesn't get mentioned in the mainstream media however, same as the Wanderers supporter who was issued with a ban when he was not even at the said game and was in fact overseas!

Why is that the FFA's job though??

It is the club hosting the game who is responsible for organising security

Problem is they take no responsibility here as they sub contract it out to the likes of NES, E Group etc

This security company then employs anyone they can get to fill their contracts. As a result you can get a variety of people who are stationed to work at a sporting event who do not have the people skills or ability to do the job.

Problem lies with the clubs who can employ the security directly themselves. They choose not to because they are too lazy to do so. They have the ability to train and coordinate the security staff then if they are paying them and tailoring the way they operate to their clientele

Football fans are a different breed of people. Maybe if our security staff were actually given appropriate training to understand what is going on we have less problems.

Problem is everyone wants to blame the FFA for the individual clubs choice in Security provider??

Why??

[The Dunster]

Why is that the FFA's job though??

It is the club hosting the game who is responsible for organising security

Problem is they take no responsibility here as they sub contract it out to the likes of NES, E Group etc

This security company then employs anyone they can get to fill their contracts. As a result you can get a variety of people who are stationed to work at a sporting event who do not have the people skills or ability to do the job.

Problem lies with the clubs who can employ the security directly themselves. They choose not to because they are too lazy to do so. They have the ability to train and coordinate the security staff then if they are paying them and tailoring the way they operate to their clientele

Football fans are a different breed of people. Maybe if our security staff were actually given appropriate training to understand what is going on we have less problems.

Problem is everyone wants to blame the FFA for the individual clubs choice in Security provider??

Why??

The security companies involved make a lot of money out of these contracts and as such have grown quite powerful [politically speaking] over the years.

There is simply no way anything any of us say will have any bearing what so ever on the future of the these Security companies at A-League fixtures.

The only true way to hurt them is to simply stop going to games - which is something I have been considering for several years.

Overall, the Security firms have become too big and their influence is totally ruining sport in Australia.

I think we are at the point now that if a dozen or so Seccos raped and bashed a six year old girl the FFA and stadium management would probably ban the girl for life and nominate the Secco's for bravery and comminity service awards . It's that fooked up.

[plague]

Why??

Because football clubs would be morons for employing thier own security.
Just another layer of potential lawsuits waiting to happen.
Never mind the fact you are liable for everything they do yet are unable to govern how they behave.
Employees are the worst.


Middleby and co are smart to keep this at arms length.

[The Dunster]

Be side football clubs would be morons for employing thier own security.
Just another layer of potential lawsuits waiting to happen.
Never mind the fact you are liable for everything they do yet are unable to govern how they behave.
Employees are the worst.
Middleby and co are smart to keep this at arms length.

Wouldn't bad employees be a problem that you can source back to Human Resources not knowing shit from clay ?

The lawsuits is again another product of neo-liberalism which is ground zero when it comes to factoring out state responsibilities to the private sector.

It's a nasty game indeed.

[MFKS]

Because football clubs would be morons for employing thier own security.
Just another layer of potential lawsuits waiting to happen.
Never mind the fact you are liable for everything they do yet are unable to govern how they behave.
Employees are the worst.


Middleby and co are smart to keep this at arms length.

As for the liability thing...


The same insurances the security companies already take out for them being found liable for the actions of their staff ??
The same money the football club actually already pays anyway as it is factored into the security company's pricing arrangement with them??

Yep


Lets just cut out the middle man here

Secondly if the club is employing them then how they behave is down to the way the club selects and trains their staff in the first place.

Thirdly the way of football clubs employing their own security rather than private firms and their pool of brain dead gorillas works well in other nations. Why would it not work here??

[plague]

Wouldn't bad employees be a problem that you can source back to Human Resources not knowing shit from clay ?

Yeah I should clarify, I don't think there are necessarily 'bad employees'.
I think there are bad people and bad workplace laws. Combine those two and there you have it.

As for lawsuits, not sure who to blame but people suing bars because they get caught drink driving, someone burning their mouth on a hot coffee and someone punching out their girlfriend because they had a rough childhood.

Again, bad people and bad laws.
Hatamoto etc just getting away with what they can.

Don't hate the playa etc ect etc.

[plague]

The same insurances the security companies already take out for them being found liable for the actions of their staff ??
The same money the football club actually already pays anyway as it is factored into the security company's pricing arrangement with them??

Yep


Lets just cut out the middle man here

Secondly if the club is employing them then how they behave is down to the way the club selects and trains their staff in the first place.

Because the difference between sacking an underperforming employee and deciding not to renew a contract can not be measured in dollars and cents.
Also, on costs like training/compliance, holiday pay etc for full time employees can be avoided by cherry picking staff from an agency and only paying for the time they are on the job.

But I'm assuming you want highly trained employees who are available for 6 hours or so once every 2 weeks for 6 months of they year to be right there when you need them.
And of course some weekends you won't need as many (varying crowd numbers) so those employees can just chill on full pay yeah?

Good luck with that boss.

Your sentiment is right, your math is wrong.

[The Dunster]

Yeah I should clarify, I don't think there are necessarily 'bad employees'.
I think there are bad people and bad workplace laws. Combine those two and there you have it.

As for lawsuits, not sure who to blame but people suing bars because they get caught drink driving, someone burning their mouth on a hot coffee and someone punching out their girlfriend because they had a rough childhood.

Again, bad people and bad laws.
Hatamoto etc just getting away with what they can.

Don't hate the playa etc ect etc.

Meanwhile the ambulance chasers are making a fortune riding this wave.

[furns]

Just to clarify to everybody, security companies are hired by the stadiums not the clubs. The clubs don't have any say apart from lobbying the stadium management when the tender comes up for review. The stadium is actually directly responsible for crowd safety & security on match day not the club, so they are the ones in charge of security & coordinating with police.
While I agree that we have had issues with both NES and Egroup at various stages throughout the 11 years of the aleague, all we can do at this point is work with who is there. Having said that, the squadron committee can't go to the stadium management (who we have an ok relationship with) to suggest issues if no one lets us know of these issues to begin with.
If you have specific instances of security overstepping their boundaries please do us an email to squadronfsc@gmail.com so we can start collating this sort of information. Dates, times and names would be beneficial.

[MFKS]

Just to clarify to everybody, security companies are hired by the stadiums not the clubs. The clubs don't have any say apart from lobbying the stadium management when the tender comes up for review. The stadium is actually directly responsible for crowd safety & security on match day not the club, so they are the ones in charge of security & coordinating with police.
While I agree that we have had issues with both NES and Egroup at various stages throughout the 11 years of the aleague, all we can do at this point is work with who is there. Having said that, the squadron committee can't go to the stadium management (who we have an ok relationship with) to suggest issues if no one lets us know of these issues to begin with.
If you have specific instances of security overstepping their boundaries please do us an email to squadronfsc@gmail.com so we can start collating this sort of information. Dates, times and names would be beneficial.

So we are dealing with the same clowns who can't get a decent pitch most weeks???

FMD

[furns]

When the govt weren't giving them the money to actually get the shit fixed - yes.
That pitch hadn't been replaced in over twenty years.
Now that the money has been spent putting down a proper drainage system and hybrid turf - its now rated one of the best surfaces in the country.

All the extra money goes to sydney venues, see the recent announcement to tear down Allianz and put a roof on that abortion of a stadium at Homebush. At a cost of several billion, and Hunter Stadium can't get a measly 20mil to finish stage 4&5 of the redevelopment that's been planned for the last decade.

[plague]

I think it's great that I'll soon be able to catch an imaginary light rail into the ground to sit in the imaginary southern grandstand.

[furns]

Statement released via FB earlier today

The Squadron FSC can confirm that a meeting is being organised by a third party, between the representatives of all active supporter groups and FFA CEO David Gallop and Head of the A League Damien DeBohun.

This meeting will be held on Wednesday evening, where current issues will be discussed and hopefully addressed.

We have been communicating with leaders of the other active supporter groups in order to go into this meeting with clear objectives and expectations of what is required from the FFA in order to end our protests. These objectives are consistent across all fan groups as is our commitment to co-operating with everyone involved in order to find a solution.

The FFA has been aware of these issues for a number of years and we have only reached this point with the support of every fan who has supported the cause. We will continue to stand up for our rights and the rights of every single person who attends a FFA sanctioned event. The outcome of Wednesday's meeting, and subsequent actions will be dependent solely on FFA's willingness to address those issues fully.

One thing is certain. Change will only come about through unity of the fans.

This is not about avoiding punishment for those who do wrong. We don't want or expect special treatment, simply fairness.

We will keep everyone updated on the outcome of this meeting and future actions.

We would like to thank the organiser for their commitment and effort in making this happen.

[plague]

hey Mr Furns legit question, in your dealings with other groups (I'm assuming you are one of the contact points for Newcastle active) has there been any discussion as to what the active groups are going to give the FFA in this meeting?
In the statement above there is a clear message about what you want them to do, but has there been any thought about what you are going to give them in reutrn? Do you have a united position or are each group discussing these things differently?


cheers,
Plague.

[furns]

The groups are reaching consensus via discussion to reach a united position. We are currently working through a list of items to present to the FFA.
I can't really go into further details at the moment unfortunately.

[lquiquer]

Apparently **someone Kevin airs is strongly suggesting might sue if you mention his name** hey!!!....

[WolfMan]

hey Mr Furns legit question, in your dealings with other groups (I'm assuming you are one of the contact points for Newcastle active) has there been any discussion as to what the active groups are going to give the FFA in this meeting?
In the statement above there is a clear message about what you want them to do, but has there been any thought about what you are going to give them in reutrn? Do you have a united position or are each group discussing these things differently?


cheers,
Plague.

Hang on, so now we have to give people something to get a fair appeals process in place? Something that should have been part and parcel of the whole process to begin with.

Dead set LMAO

[Blackmac79]

Apparently **someone Kevin airs is strongly suggesting might sue if you mention his name* hey!!!....

guy has always been a snide prick.

Time to go Mr **someone Kevin airs is strongly suggesting might sue if you mention his name*.

[plague]

Hang on, so now we have to give people something to get a fair appeals process in place? Something that should have been part and parcel of the whole process to begin with.

Dead set LMAO

yes, just like the banning of flares was part and parcel from the beginning. Didn't stop you* thumbing your nose at that, why are you shocked the FFA told you to go **** yourselves over the appeals thing?
y'all can't be that naive right?

Good negotiating:
"hey we want this, and you want this if we both get what we want then its a win win".

Bad negotiating:
"hey, we demand all of this, and we give you nothing in return".

Now: considering that 'this' is something that doesnt matter to 9 out of the 10 supporter groups then you are effectively giving up nothing in return for what you want.

Thats good negotiating.

All the 9/10 supporter groups need to do is demand that the 1/10 (i.e. the minority) change their ways. Once again, the RBB wants something from you (your support) then they need to give up something in return (the behaviour).
thats good negotiating.

*once you align yourselves with the other supporter groups rightly or wrongly you are lumped in with them. If this turns feral it tarnishes all of you, if theres a good outcome then you all look good. No half measures, the media isn't bothering with nuance in this debate. accept it because thats the reality of the situation.

[GazFish35]

Media doesn't do nuance at all.
Not sure news corp particularly could even spell it.

Most frustrating thing is, some journos know there's way more detail than they report but choose to tell the dumbed down version to inflame things.

Gerard wheately won a sports journalism award a few weeks ago, yet his coverage of the issue on offsides was pathetic.