Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 123 LastLast
Results 21 to 40 of 55

Thread: Competition Restructure 2017

  1. #21
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Location
    KOTARA STH
    Posts
    15,590
    Quote Originally Posted by LongSufferingFan View Post
    Don't be so fast to dismiss this idea.
    I watched a fair bit of NewFM this year and IMO it was very obvious the 19s competition was of a higher technical standard than the 23s.
    I can't comment on NPL but the NewFM 23s comp in 2015 was a bit of a no mans land comp - players not good enough for NewFM fist grade but too old for 19s.

    The argument that NNSWF are putting forward is that the 22s/23s comp is not elite therefore should not exist.

    Yes I understand that your long term club players will be playing 22s/23s and that they are the backbone of the Club.
    So why cant clubs have ZL3 teams or All Age to cater for these players rather than pretending they are elite?

    Just a thought.
    Your thoughts are spot on

    Clubs are being forced to develop their youth better and having them ready for first grade by 20 years of age

    If the kids ain't good enough to be in first grade at 20 having them play all age or zone is where they deserve to be

    Sure there will be the occasional late bloomer but having them toil in the lower echelons is not the problem

    The problem is the short sightedness of people worried about blokes in the 21-23 years bracket who are not playing first grade and the what will happen to them attitude.

    The onus has to be on yoof and the FFA are structuring the comps around the country to address it.

    Deal with it people

    The sky ain't falling

  2. #22
    Senior Member The Postman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2014
    Posts
    560
    Seems like Northern will decide after all the applications are in to what route they will go.

    - Enough decent applications and there will be 2 NPL divisions with 1sts, 20s, 18s, 16s, 15s, 14s and 13s.

    - If not, they might still run a 2nd division but with no Promotion and Relegation.

  3. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Goatscheese View Post
    Is NewFM meant to be considered elite? It's a third tier comp in Australia, no one should think the players in the reserves side are elite.
    I think this is the point NNSWF are trying to make with the comp restructure.

    NNSWF want to only run elite comps - ie. NPL Snr and Yoof and WPL
    Any teams not elite should be playing interdistrict under the NF/MF/HVF banner.

    NewFM teams have a decision to make - bite the bullet, become a more professional club and apply for a NPL license or else play Zone League.

    My gut feel is that NNSWF will be pretty flexible with applying the criteria if they see a club as genuinely trying to improve.
    It is in NNSWF interest to get at least 14 NPL licensed Clubs so they can run their preferred NPL 1&2 model.

    Any NewFM club that thinks they can sit back and hope NNSWF will run with 1 NPL division and continue with newFM with no promotion/relegation is asking for trouble and will probably find themselves playing Zone league in 2017 by default.

  4. #24
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2015
    Posts
    558
    Quote Originally Posted by LongSufferingFan View Post
    I think this is the point NNSWF are trying to make with the comp restructure.

    NNSWF want to only run elite comps - ie. NPL Snr and Yoof and WPL
    Any teams not elite should be playing interdistrict under the NF/MF/HVF banner.

    NewFM teams have a decision to make - bite the bullet, become a more professional club and apply for a NPL license or else play Zone League.

    My gut feel is that NNSWF will be pretty flexible with applying the criteria if they see a club as genuinely trying to improve.
    It is in NNSWF interest to get at least 14 NPL licensed Clubs so they can run their preferred NPL 1&2 model.

    Any NewFM club that thinks they can sit back and hope NNSWF will run with 1 NPL division and continue with newFM with no promotion/relegation is asking for trouble and will probably find themselves playing Zone league in 2017 by default.
    How does 14 NPL licensed clubs allow there to be an NPL 1&2 model. What are we going to have, two 7 team competitions?

  5. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by winner View Post
    How does 14 NPL licensed clubs allow there to be an NPL 1&2 model. What are we going to have, two 7 team competitions?
    My understanding is with 14 licensed clubs the format would be NPL 1 = 8 teams, NPL 2 = 6 teams (presumably three rounds).

  6. #26
    Senior Member The Postman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2014
    Posts
    560
    Quote Originally Posted by LongSufferingFan View Post
    My understanding is with 14 licensed clubs the format would be NPL 1 = 8 teams, NPL 2 = 6 teams (presumably three rounds).
    So 2 clubs get dropped from current NPL joining Lakes and Southy plus whatever 2 current NewFM teams can meet the criteria.

  7. #27
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2015
    Posts
    558
    Quote Originally Posted by LongSufferingFan View Post
    My understanding is with 14 licensed clubs the format would be NPL 1 = 8 teams, NPL 2 = 6 teams (presumably three rounds).
    This would be a massive step backwards imo. A 6 team competition would be laughable

  8. #28
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Posts
    187
    Quote Originally Posted by LongSufferingFan View Post
    My understanding is with 14 licensed clubs the format would be NPL 1 = 8 teams, NPL 2 = 6 teams (presumably three rounds).
    If all teams that are in NPL have single use grounds then there would be no reason they could not play two rounds of games with no final series only first past the post. Twenty six games and no more debate about who hosts GF's etc. Win Win for everyone.

  9. #29
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Location
    Newcastle
    Posts
    526
    Looking at the proposed changes, there's definitely some positives in there but as with anything negatives as well. If there happens to be one 14 team NPL is there enough kids out there to fill 13's/14's etc and still be competitive. Bringing in these changes in 2017 seems like a year or two too soon IMO. I feel as though it should be a two or three-year changeover to allow New-FM clubs to work towards a possible NPL1/2 competition.

    It'll be interesting to see how clubs react. Some New-FM clubs are ahead of others but it'd be great to see all 11 put the hard yards in. Still, it's a lot of additional work for clubs who are short on volunteers. But as some have said, it is a way forward and brings NNSW into line with some of the other federations. Hopefully NNSWF will be helpful and keep the door open for any clubs that want to make the step up.

  10. #30
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Location
    Thyra 7
    Posts
    364
    Quote Originally Posted by Local Rules View Post
    If all teams that are in NPL have single use grounds then there would be no reason they could not play two rounds of games with no final series only first past the post. Twenty six games and no more debate about who hosts GF's etc. Win Win for everyone.
    Could you imagine some of the club's wage bills after 26 rounds

  11. #31
    Senior Member Zico's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Posts
    790
    I still think an U/20's is over the top. U/22's is a fair and reasonable compromise between the feds ideal comp and the clubs wishes of a reserve grade.

    The fed are to an extent limited as the FFA are handing down these rules but surely they would listen too and support the stakeholders to do what they can to do the best for the local clubs which after all are the reason we have a comp in this area.

    If the Fed want a comp full of clubs with no soul, very few supporters and even less volunteers then this model is the perfect way to achieve this. Making a comp that promotes youth is fantastic but this can be achieved without sacrificing clubs in the proccess.

    My hope is that the fed listen and act in the correct manner for this area before they screw the comp and we lose both the clubs and the youth development.

  12. #32
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Location
    KOTARA STH
    Posts
    15,590
    Quote Originally Posted by Zico View Post
    I still think an U/20's is over the top. U/22's is a fair and reasonable compromise between the feds ideal comp and the clubs wishes of a reserve grade.

    The fed are to an extent limited as the FFA are handing down these rules but surely they would listen too and support the stakeholders to do what they can to do the best for the local clubs which after all are the reason we have a comp in this area.

    If the Fed want a comp full of clubs with no soul, very few supporters and even less volunteers then this model is the perfect way to achieve this. Making a comp that promotes youth is fantastic but this can be achieved without sacrificing clubs in the proccess.

    My hope is that the fed listen and act in the correct manner for this area before they screw the comp and we lose both the clubs and the youth development.
    How exactly are you sacrificing clubs by going to a Yoof model???

    In theory you are strengthening clubs as your first grade side in theory should be kids who have come through the grades and are playing firsts and not mercenaries who play for new club every year

    Issue lies with the clubs to open their eyes and change the way they operate.

    Evolve or perish

  13. #33
    Senior Member Premy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    Posts
    3,831
    Quote Originally Posted by Zico View Post
    I still think an U/20's is over the top. U/22's is a fair and reasonable compromise between the feds ideal comp and the clubs wishes of a reserve grade.

    The fed are to an extent limited as the FFA are handing down these rules but surely they would listen too and support the stakeholders to do what they can to do the best for the local clubs which after all are the reason we have a comp in this area.

    If the Fed want a comp full of clubs with no soul, very few supporters and even less volunteers then this model is the perfect way to achieve this. Making a comp that promotes youth is fantastic but this can be achieved without sacrificing clubs in the proccess.

    My hope is that the fed listen and act in the correct manner for this area before they screw the comp and we lose both the clubs and the youth development.
    As someone stated earlier every club has the option to field a ZL team, treat that as your reserve grade. I'm with member on this one move forward or get left behind.
    Quote Originally Posted by #fixsmithpark View Post
    I'M GULLIBLE!

  14. #34
    Thinking this through it may reduce the excessive player payment issue as well as make for a more even playing field across the clubs.

    If there is a closer link between a clubs juniors and first grade then logic says you are more likely to have your juniors play first grade.
    This reduces the need to buy players in, meaning that (perhaps) there wont be the pressure to pay excessive player payments.

    With less player movement you are also likely to see a more even comp as the clubs with money won't find it so easy to buy premierships.
    The focus will need to shift to developing juniors.

    All of this is a good thing IMO - certainly worth a try.

  15. #35
    Senior Member Zico's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Posts
    790
    Quote Originally Posted by MFKS View Post
    How exactly are you sacrificing clubs by going to a Yoof model???

    In theory you are strengthening clubs as your first grade side in theory should be kids who have come through the grades and are playing firsts and not mercenaries who play for new club every year

    Issue lies with the clubs to open their eyes and change the way they operate.

    Evolve or perish
    At a bare minimum alloyed 5 plus Keeper over age in 20's then but I can see both sides of the argument and the pro's and con's of both.

    We have produced more players into the NSL and Socceroos when we had the old system, how many have we produced since the Fed got rid of reserve grade and added the numerous age groups over reserve grade?

    A balance is required and I agree that we need to produce quality youth, this can be achieved through correct coaching and lowering the cost of advanced coaching coarse to get as many coaches educated rather than tampering with age groups and comp structures.

    Start with the most basic level (coaching to produce these youth players) and then change things from there if it's not working still.

    I hate this thought proccess that players who are experienced and can be of huge benefit to the younger players should be scrap heaped.

  16. #36
    Senior Member Zico's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Posts
    790
    Quote Originally Posted by Premy View Post
    As someone stated earlier every club has the option to field a ZL team, treat that as your reserve grade. I'm with member on this one move forward or get left behind.
    So it's a very real possibility that a very strong player who may be good enough for first grade and an excellent mentor to a young player on the pitch could be sent packing back the ZL? What a waste of a great opportunity to bring these young players through with experienced players to guide them.
    We are killing our comp, what other comp does this in the sporting world?

  17. #37
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Location
    KOTARA STH
    Posts
    15,590
    Quote Originally Posted by Zico View Post
    At a bare minimum alloyed 5 plus Keeper over age in 20's then but I can see both sides of the argument and the pro's and con's of both.

    We have produced more players into the NSL and Socceroos when we had the old system, how many have we produced since the Fed got rid of reserve grade and added the numerous age groups over reserve grade?

    A balance is required and I agree that we need to produce quality youth, this can be achieved through correct coaching and lowering the cost of advanced coaching coarse to get as many coaches educated rather than tampering with age groups and comp structures.

    Start with the most basic level (coaching to produce these youth players) and then change things from there if it's not working still.

    I hate this thought proccess that players who are experienced and can be of huge benefit to the younger players should be scrap heaped.
    Our development of NSL or HAL level and Soccerroos players gave been shit for years

    You have to back 15-20 years to find much of note in Middleby and Zane

    Before that you had your Lowes Baartzs Maier's Tredinnicjs etc

    Recent years we have barely had national league players


    As for this thought on these experienced players playing reserve grade. This 5 player concession to me is a cop out and should be scrapped

    If blokes are not good enough for first grade play in the Zone leagues

    Why exactly is the not good enough players really part of the discussion here.???

    If they are good enough they are playing at higher level. If you ain't good enough you find your level and okay zone or all age

    No free handouts in life

    As for the experienced players why are the coaches and senior first grade players doing???

    Are they not able to mentor the kids???

  18. #38
    Senior Member Zico's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Posts
    790
    Quote Originally Posted by MFKS View Post
    Our development of NSL or HAL level and Soccerroos players gave been shit for years

    You have to back 15-20 years to find much of note in Middleby and Zane

    Before that you had your Lowes Baartzs Maier's Tredinnicjs etc

    Recent years we have barely had national league players


    As for this thought on these experienced players playing reserve grade. This 5 player concession to me is a cop out and should be scrapped

    If blokes are not good enough for first grade play in the Zone leagues

    Why exactly is the not good enough players really part of the discussion here.???

    If they are good enough they are playing at higher level. If you ain't good enough you find your level and okay zone or all age

    No free handouts in life

    As for the experienced players why are the coaches and senior first grade players doing???

    Are they not able to mentor the kids???
    I think you will find that the federation got rid of the tried and tested reserve grade around the same time the player development through to the higher levels dried up.

    Don't underestimate the value of the old head on the pitch to develop a future star.

  19. #39
    Senior Member Premy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    Posts
    3,831
    Quote Originally Posted by Zico View Post
    So it's a very real possibility that a very strong player who may be good enough for first grade and an excellent mentor to a young player on the pitch could be sent packing back the ZL? What a waste of a great opportunity to bring these young players through with experienced players to guide them.
    We are killing our comp, what other comp does this in the sporting world?
    I'm not certain on the details now but I'm sure when the Zone Leagues started 5-6 years ago players could be duel registered if the two teams came under the same club. What is Stopping any NPL club duel resisting a ZL player to call them up when needed or a U/18 player so you can put him in ZL 1st grade if you want him to play with older heads?

    Edit: Again I'm not certain but I'm pretty sure Cooks Hill have been doing something similar to this for a few years now.
    Last edited by Premy; 11-12-2015 at 06:16 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by #fixsmithpark View Post
    I'M GULLIBLE!

  20. #40
    Senior Member Zico's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Posts
    790
    Quote Originally Posted by Premy View Post
    I'm not certain on the details now but I'm sure when the Zone Leagues started 5-6 years ago players could be duel registered if the two teams came under the same club. What is Stopping any NPL club duel resisting a ZL player to call them up when needed or a U/18 player so you can put him in ZL 1st grade if you want him to play with older heads?

    Edit: Again I'm not certain but I'm pretty sure Cooks Hill have been doing something similar to this for a few years now.
    That's a decent idea if it is able to be done.
    What is the requirement for the Zone League clubs? Is it 3 grades? if so I think it makes it very difficult to have the Zone League side that has been thrown about.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •