The Politics/Religion/Conspiracies Deathmatch Thread

[plague]

The sad thing is the massive attention this shit is receiving on social media. Elsewhere you have women and children being persecuted / raped / enforced in slavery and yet a very well paid person has a melt down at work and that's where everyone's attention is.

There are millions of persons suffering because of their gender and socioeconomic status - Serena Williams is not one of them.

I have 2 points on this whole episode.

1. I am not black, nor a woman. I have never experienced racism or sexism. If Serena Williams (any any african american) is offended by the cartoon, then ok, I have no choice but to believe them. But the likes of the usual suspects (most of whom are white/middle class westerners) claiming to be 'offended' by the cartoon is a bit off the mark. They just want to be on the right side of the argument, when they really have no place in the argument. The French Open/Catsuit issue a few weeks ago was a great example of that.

2. One of the best words that have sprung up in the last little bit has been 'whataboutism'. This is used almost exclusivley by the anti-Trump brigade who use the term as a term of ridicule when Trump (or his supporters) bring up any indiscretion by Hillary/Obama etc. They tell me that Trump is guilty and by indulging in 'whataboutism' further discredits him.

Yet the second the Serena thing started, those same voices didnt mind pulling out the 'whataboutism' when bringing mens behaviour into the argument.

In short.

I dont care about the cartoon.
People are hypocrites.

#MAGA
#Trump2020
#jetfuelcantmeltsteelbeams

[MFKS]

Exactly what though was the issue to start with

She got caught by the umpire being coached from the stands

The umpire applied a sanction as he was entitled to do

She spat the dummy over it and lost the plot.


We not talking about a young rookie here but a seasoned veteran


Anyone want to offer up it as just a show from her as a tactic to try and unsettle her opponent as Serenas tennis wasnt doing it ??

Obviously didnt work

But exactly what wasthe problem with the umpires response ??
Did he claim to be be doing it because she was female,??
Did he claim to be doing it because of her skin colour??

Not from what I have seen

Just people jumping to conclusions and playing the sex and race cards to carry on

[plague]

Exactly what though was the issue to start with

She got caught by the umpire being coached from the stands

The umpire applied a sanction as he was entitled to do

She spat the dummy over it and lost the plot.


We not talking about a young rookie here but a seasoned veteran


Anyone want to offer up it as just a show from her as a tactic to try and unsettle her opponent as Serenas tennis wasnt doing it ??

Obviously didnt work

But exactly what wasthe problem with the umpires response ??
Did he claim to be be doing it because she was female,??
Did he claim to be doing it because of her skin colour??

Not from what I have seen

Just people jumping to conclusions and playing the sex and race cards to carry on

From your perspective its hard to argue any of this.
You'll also probably find a lot of the general public would agree with you.

what none of us know, however, is Serena Williams' perspective on it.
To hear about her childhood, her upbringing, the crap she copped all the way up, the crap she copped once she got there, and the crap she still gets today, I can totally see how she sees it as just another example of her being treated differently from the rest, when maybe she thinks she deserves more respect.

I mean, we talk all the time about how referees have different interpretations for different teams in football. everyone in this is human, and they all allowed to be fallible.

[MFKS]

From your perspective its hard to argue any of this.
You'll also probably find a lot of the general public would agree with you.

what none of us know, however, is Serena Williams' perspective on it.
To hear about her childhood, her upbringing, the crap she copped all the way up, the crap she copped once she got there, and the crap she still gets today, I can totally see how she sees it as just another example of her being treated differently from the rest, when maybe she thinks she deserves more respect.

I mean, we talk all the time about how referees have different interpretations for different teams in football. everyone in this is human, and they all allowed to be fallible.

But in the middle of a tennis match how she feels about the officials call and whether she likes it or not is irrelevant

You still have to suck it up and get on with the game

No one gives a **** about her opinion on the matter either. Her sense of self entitlement here has **** all to do with anything


Wonder if old mate umpire will sue her for the defamation of his character that she made baseless accusations about ??

[plague]

But in the middle of a tennis match how she feels about the officials call and whether she likes it or not is irrelevant

You still have to suck it up and get on with the game

No one gives a **** about her opinion on the matter either. Her sense of self entitlement here has **** all to do with anything


Wonder if old mate umpire will sue her for the defamation of his character that she made baseless accusations about ??

she was having her ass handed to her on a night when she was chasing history, in front of her 'home' crowd. Its prob the most pressure shes ever faced on the court and she cracked.

you see it with Berisha, O'Donovan etc.
i aint even for one second trying to step into their shoes, i cant ever think of being under such pressure, so no idea how id act.

but if theres one thing that bothered me about it, it was the post match comments, and the 'reaction' from the media. they asked her a bunch of softball questions and actually cheered her after the press conference was finished. i know its a small example, but this is why Trump gets such milage from demonising the press.

The press should have gone way harder on her, yet they all fear their access to the superstar will be revoked if they rock the boat (and they prob have Sir Alex to thank for that).

In the big moment, the ump cracked, the player cracked and the press cracked.

meanwhile Osaka cleaned house and no one gave her any respect either.

Shes the one who actually has a fair reason to gripe.

again, applying the rules makes this an easy argument.

[The Dunster]

she was having her ass handed to her on a night when she was chasing history, in front of her 'home' crowd. Its prob the most pressure shes ever faced on the court and she cracked.

you see it with Berisha, O'Donovan etc.
i aint even for one second trying to step into their shoes, i cant ever think of being under such pressure, so no idea how id act.

but if theres one thing that bothered me about it, it was the post match comments, and the 'reaction' from the media. they asked her a bunch of softball questions and actually cheered her after the press conference was finished. i know its a small example, but this is why Trump gets such milage from demonising the press.

The press should have gone way harder on her, yet they all fear their access to the superstar will be revoked if they rock the boat (and they prob have Sir Alex to thank for that).

In the big moment, the ump cracked, the player cracked and the press cracked.

meanwhile Osaka cleaned house and no one gave her any respect either.

Shes the one who actually has a fair reason to gripe.

again, applying the rules makes this an easy argument.

Agreed. Great post Plague.

[MFKS]

Agreed. Great post Plague.

The umpire didnt crack though

He made the calls in accordance with the rules

1 Warning for coaching

CORRECT

2 Point for Smashing her racket

CORRECT

3 Game for her abuse calling him a thief etc

CORRECT


All he done was applied the rules when issues of rule violations come up


But as per typical of modern society it somehow his fault **** off it is

Be like us blaming the ref for giving Roy a red for his kung fu kick

The 10 weeks we can argue about but not the red card or the suspension for it

[pv4]

I am not black, nor a woman.

Every time I learn more about your personal life I adore you more, plaguesey.

[pv4]

The two things I've taken from this Serena incident is:
- If I called a ref in football a thief and claimed he robbed me a point, I'd be getting minimum 2 game suspension without any form of question. Serena needs to be (pun intended) slammed for this comment. And if similar or worse genuinely happens in tennis, which I truthfully haven't seen, then that too needs to be slammed (used it again, no regrets). And the gender, or even the level of competition, of the guilty party is irrelevant in comparison to the consistency of the umpires needed.
- the most racist part of "that" cartoon was the depiction of Serena's opponent ops:

[plague]

The umpire didnt crack though

He made the calls in accordance with the rules

1 Warning for coaching

CORRECT

2 Point for Smashing her racket

CORRECT

3 Game for her abuse calling him a thief etc

CORRECT


All he done was applied the rules when issues of rule violations come up


But as per typical of modern society it somehow his fault **** off it is

Again, to be clear. I ain't blaming the umpire.
The ump had absolutely zero to do with Serena losing.
Osaka was the reason Serena lost.


But.



Discretion can be applied to the 1st and 3rd violations. He chose to be strict and I'm cool with it.

But 'feminist twitter', joining forces with 'black twitter' have come up with plenty of examples where the same ump used way more leniency with white/Male players. And that's where the 'prejudice' argument has come in.

Again, I'm cool with what the ump did. But if Serena feels she was treated differently from the men, and the white girls, well then that's the point you, me and all the other honkies cant dive into.


I'll defend the ump because it's the same reason I hate VAR.

Stop trying to make humans perfect.
We cant all be Griff.

[plague]

Every time I learn more about your personal life I adore you more, plaguesey.

I'm also a pathalogical liar.

So yeah, you can do with that whatever.

[plague]

Actually one thing I learned from the cartoon is that a LOT of very loud Americans think Australia is a super, super racist country.

[Frodo]

In regards to the match.

Serena didn't handle losing well and did a good job of deflecting the blame onto the ref to save her brand (Any attention can be good attention if you are smart enough). If that was the end of the story I think it would be pretty normal.

In regards to the cartoon.

There will always be a fine line between Satire and Racism and we do need to be careful to stop people using satire as an excuse to be racist. I'm very confident the cartoonist had every intention of hitting a nerve with his depiction, but he wasn't doing it from a racist stand point. He was just ridiculing her and one of her strongest features is her skin colour. She is very proudly african-american and in satire you need to hit them where it hurts. (Trumpf's hair and tweets, Obama's smile and wife, Turnbulls money, Abbots nose and budgee smugglers)

He gets publicity out of it, the papers sell more copies, Serena gets noticed more than the 1st Japanese Singles Grand Slam Champion EVER! The powers at be win again.

[pv4]

Americans think Australia is a super, super racist country.

They're not exactly wrong.

[Macca]

They're not exactly wrong.

They're not wrong, but fairly ironic and bold for them to be taking high grounds on racism.

[MFKS]

In regards to the match.

Serena didn't handle losing well and did a good job of deflecting the blame onto the ref to save her brand (Any attention can be good attention if you are smart enough). If that was the end of the story I think it would be pretty normal.

In regards to the cartoon.

There will always be a fine line between Satire and Racism and we do need to be careful to stop people using satire as an excuse to be racist. I'm very confident the cartoonist had every intention of hitting a nerve with his depiction, but he wasn't doing it from a racist stand point. He was just ridiculing her and one of her strongest features is her skin colour. She is very proudly african-american and in satire you need to hit them where it hurts. (Trumpf's hair and tweets, Obama's smile and wife, Turnbulls money, Abbots nose and budgee smugglers)

He gets publicity out of it, the papers sell more copies, Serena gets noticed more than the 1st Japanese Singles Grand Slam Champion EVER! The powers at be win again.

That also being said Sereba is a black women by depicting her in a cartoon straight away you are going to have every half wit screaming racism
for acturally drawing a physical description

The exact same thing a cartoonist does on a daily basis with the likes if Trump Abbott ScoMo Turnbull etc and there is never any comment there at all

[plague]

That also being said Sereba is a black women by depicting her in a cartoon straight away you are going to have every half wit screaming racism
for acturally drawing a physical description

The exact same thing a cartoonist does on a daily basis with the likes if Trump Abbott ScoMo Turnbull etc and there is never any comment there at all

Yeah gotta side with the Member here. What colour are you supposed to paint a block persons skin?

Funnily enough in one tweet, that Harry Potter broad said he was racist for painting a black woman black, and racist for painting Osaka as a fair skinned blonde girl.


At least his employers backed him, as you will see from today's front page of that same paper.

[plague]

They're not exactly wrong.

Wow. You really think we as a country are super racist?

As much as there are plenty of examples of scumbags, I've never thought we as a society are like that.

What makes you think that?

[Serd1]

The drawing was of a Black woman having a dummy spit, all this PC BULLSHIT can F%#K OFF..
There was nothing racist about the drawing.
#illridewithmarkknight

[MFKS]

Wow. You really think we as a country are super racist?

As much as there are plenty of examples of scumbags, I've never thought we as a society are like that.

What makes you think that?

I would say we actually are a pretty racist country in the grand scheme of things

Our geographic isolation in that it 3 hours to NZ and 5 hours to PNG and couple of hours to Pacific Islands mean that we have an isolation mentality

Basically everyone here is not exposed to different cultures as you get elsewhere in the world

We also have the added dynamic where for some reason we seem to want to apologise for a decision made by the British Government 230 years and pander to the descendants of those effected by it

So as a result we have a divisiveness and insecurity about ourselves