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Thread: The Politics/Religion/Conspiracies Deathmatch Thread

  1. #2021
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    Quote Originally Posted by GazFish35 View Post
    My concern isn't literate uni students.
    It's illiterate teens who go on to be illiterate adults.

    There's links between a nation's education levels and crime rates, health and welfare dependencies.
    Educate the population or the population suffers.

    I agree the job market has changed significantly, the economy is vastly different now to how it was when the education system was created. Mass manufacturing jobs don't exist like they did and it's no longer as feasible for an illertae low-ses population to find work. The education system needs updating in order to meet the needs of the labour market, so let's do that rather than expect the labour market to go back in time and rely on large volumes of unskilled labour - we can't compete with international markets that way.

    And an education is more than just about preparedness for the workforce. Literate, critical hunkers are more likely to make better health choices and reducing the strain on the health system also.
    Can blame school teachers for literacy issues.

    5 5 5

  2. #2022
    in awe of baz GazFish35's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Couscous View Post
    Gaz, I'm no expert and welcome any feedback, but this is my impression of school funding policy.

    Before Labor won office in 2007, it had spoken vaguely about considering needs-based funding, without committing to a specific model. During its six years in office (Rudd and Gillard eras), Labor did almost nothing to change school funding, though Gillard eventually commissioned the Gonski review. Gonski reported shortly before Labor lost office. Since then, Labor has campaigned hard to implement the Gonski recommendations.

    Why should I believe Labor is fair dinkum about needs-based school funding when it dithered for six years?

    Gillard got bugger all done due to the nature of the parliament at the time, labour also threw cash at the school system to assist the economy through the gfc (and got sfa in terms of value for money) so they at least have a that as a defence.

    I suppose I'm basing my views of the libs saying we won't, and the labs saying they will.

    The only thing for certain is the libs won't. Leaving the only hope for what I see as the most urgent need for govt spending to actually happen is that the reds get in.
    Quote Originally Posted by Blackmac79 View Post
    I tend to agree with Gav.

  3. #2023
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    Quote Originally Posted by GazFish35 View Post
    labour also threw cash at the school system to assist the economy through the gfc (and got sfa in terms of value for money) so they at least have a that as a defence.

    I suppose I'm basing my views of the libs saying we won't, and the labs saying they will.
    I guess from the sceptics point of view is that Labors answer will once again be to throw cash up against a wall and hope it sticks.

    Every person you spoke to back in the day wanted that GFC cash to spend on maintenance and services not new halls. If the folks on the ground (like yourself) had been listened to back then Gonski might not be such a massive animal right now.

    It all comes back to whether Labor can be 'trusted' to get it right I guess.

  4. #2024
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    Quote Originally Posted by plague View Post
    Firstly you forgot to include 'ivory towers' in your cliche driven post there but anyway your comment is an oft repeated stance by 'the worker'.

    All I'm asking is how stopper2 is personally impacted by the party that is in govt.

    I mean, people have strong stances on this stuff I just want to know why.

    It's a fair question.

    1/Entitlements, the Libs have been gunning for years to not only remove double time penalty rates but ultimately all penalty rates.
    2/Their constant attacks on the Union movement but completely ignoring big business getting away with paying very small or even no taxes in some cases.
    I could go on but really couldn't be bothered, the Libs clearly want to go down the American path, they believ in "trickle down economics" but that doesn't work in reality because of the insatiable greed up the top.

  5. #2025
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    Funny how perceptions change over the years. 10 years ago I was a CPSU loving public servant (with a safe job and pension) who decided that working till I was 65 was terribly beige and would not generate wealth.

    Five properties and four businesses later and I can see that the ALP thinks I am middle class welfare scum, even though already I am in a position where I will never need ask for government welfare again - isn't that the point of self funding? Really pissed off with them at their -ve gearing stance - we are not all rich.

    And the unions - CPSU whinge whenever there are staff cutbacks in the APS. But if the funding isn't there isn't that what should happen - and have you ever tried to sack someone in the APS who won't do their job? When times are good you employ, when they are bad you cutback. Was so sick of their "join us comrades" propaganda every bargaining agreement time. They did nothing other than whinge and whine about the "workers", their "entitlements" and "eroding conditions".

    After 30 years voting ALP I swung big time to the Libs last election - I see no need to go back this time around.

    Everything that Kyosaki and Trump predicted is now happening- and as Stopper said that is the way we are headed.
    Last edited by Jetmaster; 18-05-2016 at 06:30 PM.

  6. #2026
    in awe of baz GazFish35's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MFKS View Post
    Can blame school teachers for literacy issues.

    5 5 5
    If only it was so simple.
    Bit like blaming doctors for Cancer.
    Quote Originally Posted by Blackmac79 View Post
    I tend to agree with Gav.

  7. #2027
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    Quote Originally Posted by GazFish35 View Post
    If only it was so simple.
    Bit like blaming doctors for Cancer.
    Sorry that was just too easy.

    You set it up so well it was ready to pull the trigger on

  8. #2028
    in awe of baz GazFish35's Avatar
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    I wish I taught kids who were so open to my assistance!
    Quote Originally Posted by Blackmac79 View Post
    I tend to agree with Gav.

  9. #2029
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    Quote Originally Posted by GazFish35 View Post
    My concern isn't literate uni students.
    It's illiterate teens who go on to be illiterate adults.

    There's links between a nation's education levels and crime rates, health and welfare dependencies.
    Educate the population or the population suffers.

    I agree the job market has changed significantly, the economy is vastly different now to how it was when the education system was created. Mass manufacturing jobs don't exist like they did and it's no longer as feasible for an illertae low-ses population to find work. The education system needs updating in order to meet the needs of the labour market, so let's do that rather than expect the labour market to go back in time and rely on large volumes of unskilled labour - we can't compete with international markets that way.

    And an education is more than just about preparedness for the workforce. Literate, critical hunkers are more likely to make better health choices and reducing the strain on the health system also.
    When the supply of labour is growing faster than the demand for labour, and the share of income going to capital is increasing faster than the share to workers - how do you propose that education will help ?

    Employment in a mixed capitalist system is an exogenously determined variable whereby there is a level of income compatible with full employment.

    Unemployment exists because there is a gap between actual spending and the level compatible with full employment.
    The non-governments contribution is essentially endogenously determined by economic activity [ much like the money supply]. People get laid off in downturns and employed when things pick up.... and so on
    The government however has the ability to fill the gap between the actual level of spending and the required level of spending.
    In other words the government has a choice to create full employment or it can choose not to.

    The problem with Gonski is that it does absolutely nothing to create jobs. What is the point of educating someone so they can be unemployed ?

  10. #2030
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    Quote Originally Posted by stopper2 View Post
    1/Entitlements, the Libs have been gunning for years to not only remove double time penalty rates but ultimately all penalty rates.
    2/Their constant attacks on the Union movement but completely ignoring big business getting away with paying very small or even no taxes in some cases.
    I could go on but really couldn't be bothered, the Libs clearly want to go down the American path, they believ in "trickle down economics" but that doesn't work in reality because of the insatiable greed up the top.

  11. #2031
    in awe of baz GazFish35's Avatar
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    What's the point?

    It's not solely about producing a workforce.

    Any decent education system should also be able to produce functional citizens who can maintain healthy lifestyles, positive relationships and solve problems.

    Australia for my mind is also based on the principles of social justice and needs based funding helps address the inequalities that are a reality for many Australian kids dues to inequities they encounter through no fault of their own.
    Quote Originally Posted by Blackmac79 View Post
    I tend to agree with Gav.

  12. #2032
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    That's what education SHOULD be about Gaz - unfortunately the reality is it is all about creating drones for tertiary education and then the workforce.

    The most successful business minds in this world dropped out of school - they are the ones that got it.

  13. #2033
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jetmaster View Post
    That's what education SHOULD be about Gaz - unfortunately the reality is it is all about creating drones for tertiary education and then the workforce.

    The most successful business minds in this world dropped out of school - they are the ones that got it.
    Like Pablo Escobar ?

    15 Tonnes of cocaine smuggled into the USA per day at around $300 per gram.
    $2500 per month for rubber bands just to wrap the notes into $1000 bundles.

    Great role model and more proof an education is a waste of time.

    And no I am not taking the piss.

  14. #2034
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    oi dunz where do you work?

  15. #2035
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    Quote Originally Posted by q-money View Post
    oi dunz where do you work?
    I work in a low wage Clerical position in Newcastle. Why ?

  16. #2036
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jetmaster View Post
    That's what education SHOULD be about Gaz - unfortunately the reality is it is all about creating drones for tertiary education and then the workforce.

    The most successful business minds in this world dropped out of school - they are the ones that got it.
    yeah but this isn't the fault of the teachers themselves.
    blame the system sure, but the individuals trying to implement it. nah.

    having said that, as an 'uneducated' person, i was steered into my lane by my school teachers who took me aside and pointed out my strengths and weaknesses.
    without that guidance i wouldn't be doing what I'm doing, and for that I'm forever grateful.
    Quote Originally Posted by MFKS View Post
    And I don't argue with FR. The bloke is a legend and deserves great praise for his contributions to football in the Hunter.
    He is also the second best poster on the entire Foz behind you
    Quote Originally Posted by parksey View Post
    sometimes there's more to life than just winning
    Quote Originally Posted by ForeverRed View Post
    What a deadset ****ing coward **** you are
    Quote Originally Posted by MFKS View Post
    Seems like I am WRONG

  17. #2037
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Dunster View Post

    15 Tonnes of cocaine smuggled into the USA per day at around $300 per gram.
    yeah look without giving anything away in the US its $100 tops but roughly half that if you buy in any quantity.
    in Oz yeah $300-350 is market rate, and its cut to shit and terrible quality.








    so I've heard.
    Quote Originally Posted by MFKS View Post
    And I don't argue with FR. The bloke is a legend and deserves great praise for his contributions to football in the Hunter.
    He is also the second best poster on the entire Foz behind you
    Quote Originally Posted by parksey View Post
    sometimes there's more to life than just winning
    Quote Originally Posted by ForeverRed View Post
    What a deadset ****ing coward **** you are
    Quote Originally Posted by MFKS View Post
    Seems like I am WRONG

  18. #2038
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Dunster View Post
    I work in a low wage Clerical position in Newcastle. Why ?
    always wondered. seem to be the most switched on economic bloke on here, i assumed you must have been richer than hawk or a finance type guy

  19. #2039
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    Quote Originally Posted by stopper2 View Post
    1/Entitlements, the Libs have been gunning for years to not only remove double time penalty rates but ultimately all penalty rates.
    2/Their constant attacks on the Union movement but completely ignoring big business getting away with paying very small or even no taxes in some cases.
    I could go on but really couldn't be bothered, the Libs clearly want to go down the American path, they believ in "trickle down economics" but that doesn't work in reality because of the insatiable greed up the top.
    well look the decision on penalty rates will be made by the independent umpire and both sides have declared they will accept the decision so your vote won't matter there.

    i believe there should be a strong union movement because the powerless should always be represented when negotiating with the powerful.

    but.

    if you think there is one iota of difference between the union bosses and the bosses of big business then you are sadly mistaken.
    the same levels of corruption, greed and self interest spread across all levels of power.

    we need unions, we need business.

    we don't need shitcunce.

    they aren't all sitting on one side of the fence.
    Quote Originally Posted by MFKS View Post
    And I don't argue with FR. The bloke is a legend and deserves great praise for his contributions to football in the Hunter.
    He is also the second best poster on the entire Foz behind you
    Quote Originally Posted by parksey View Post
    sometimes there's more to life than just winning
    Quote Originally Posted by ForeverRed View Post
    What a deadset ****ing coward **** you are
    Quote Originally Posted by MFKS View Post
    Seems like I am WRONG

  20. #2040
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    Quote Originally Posted by q-money View Post
    always wondered. seem to be the most switched on economic bloke on here, i assumed you must have been richer than hawk or a finance type guy
    I've always been of the opinion if we could get Dunster and VJ in the same room the whole paddlesteamer issue would get sorted over the first half dozen tinnies.
    Quote Originally Posted by MFKS View Post
    And I don't argue with FR. The bloke is a legend and deserves great praise for his contributions to football in the Hunter.
    He is also the second best poster on the entire Foz behind you
    Quote Originally Posted by parksey View Post
    sometimes there's more to life than just winning
    Quote Originally Posted by ForeverRed View Post
    What a deadset ****ing coward **** you are
    Quote Originally Posted by MFKS View Post
    Seems like I am WRONG

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