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Thread: Daily Australian News Thread

  1. #1301
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hunter403 View Post
    Will they all go to Europe, or will the less skilled ones end up in better paid leagues such as India, Malaysia etc (assuming wages here fall)? If our league doesn't match other leagues of a similar standard (or inferior) when it comes to wages, why would they come back? If you don't make it in Europe, then you don't make it. I think I would prefer the likes of the players you mentioned in our league, helping it draw TV, crowds etc, rather than them heading off to South Africa, USA, China or where ever. If our better players left the league, do you think Fox would continue to pay?
    Are you saying Hoffman BK and Boogaard are helping to draw TV ratings and crowds because that is the best thing I have ever heard ROFL

    As for Foxtel quite frankly I dont give a **** about their interests
    PayTV is for all intensive purposes a dead end medium

    I would also say that Foxtel have manipulated the game for their benefit the last 13 years and have in a lot of ways done a lot of harm
    I wouldnt think that coverage from them is the be all and end all of things

    Would a change here even if it meant less $$ be a bad thing if it actually got us the exposure or promotion the code needs ??

    As for your concern about blokes going to Leagues like India and Malaysia etc

    Isnt that already happening now in recent years??

    Didnt we have a pile of Socceroos go play in China when they were throwing the stupid cash about??
    What about all the Skips going and getting paid at cashed up Gulf Clubs??


    Plenty of people already getting out of Oz for the $$ Why would your suggestion be any different??

  2. #1302
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    Quote Originally Posted by Roundball Enthusiast View Post
    Na, Yeah. Ur always right hey Member.

    Thats why the game is dead in this country and participation numbers are the lowest they've ever been.

    Newy Bay 1 is 70% 15-19 year olds and most of the other Aleague active support is the same. Guess you're right there too.
    High participation rates the code has had for years

    This is in spite of the poor administration off the field
    This is in spite of the over the top costs
    This is in spite if the governments failing to provide adequate amounts of playing facilities

    Bay 1 was barely half full the last couple of weeks so 200/300 kids is no great wave of popularity that is gonna carry the game into a rosy future

    Make it 2000/3000 and your point has some bearing

  3. #1303
    infant member plague's Avatar
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    biggest problem game has had is that the clubs need to learn that long term success means getting your fans to cheer for laundry, not players.

    Victory have done it, WSW too (although their stadium issues have stalled that momentum).
    The rest seem to have no idea.
    Quote Originally Posted by MFKS View Post
    And I don't argue with FR. The bloke is a legend and deserves great praise for his contributions to football in the Hunter.
    He is also the second best poster on the entire Foz behind you
    Quote Originally Posted by parksey View Post
    sometimes there's more to life than just winning
    Quote Originally Posted by ForeverRed View Post
    What a deadset ****ing coward **** you are
    Quote Originally Posted by MFKS View Post
    Seems like I am WRONG

  4. #1304
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    Quote Originally Posted by plague View Post
    biggest problem game has had is that the clubs need to learn that long term success means getting your fans to cheer for laundry, not players.

    Victory have done it, WSW too (although their stadium issues have stalled that momentum).
    The rest seem to have no idea.
    Biggest problem is the model

    Reading tonight that Dec12 is the date the FFA will decide which of these bids gets to "buy" their way into the HAL

    Whilst ever we have Franchises buying their way in with licence fees then the comp is doomed

    No pro/rel when these "Clubs" have to vote on it and they just paid 13 million or whatever fee it is to get in

    They aint letting clubs in for free on merit not when they had to bribe their way in

    Unfortunate but true but the FFA are actually just digging a bigger hole for the game in this country with their decisions

    Also how corrupt is the practice of licensing fees??

  5. #1305
    infant member plague's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MFKS View Post
    Biggest problem is the model

    Reading tonight that Dec12 is the date the FFA will decide which of these bids gets to "buy" their way into the HAL

    Whilst ever we have Franchises buying their way in with licence fees then the comp is doomed

    No pro/rel when these "Clubs" have to vote on it and they just paid 13 million or whatever fee it is to get in

    They aint letting clubs in for free on merit not when they had to bribe their way in

    Unfortunate but true but the FFA are actually just digging a bigger hole for the game in this country with their decisions

    Also how corrupt is the practice of licensing fees??
    the flipside to that is the fear of pissing away your licence fee by fielding a shit team. Hence owners may try harder if they have more to lose.
    prob why Aston Martin owners look after their cars better than blokes with a Datsun 120Y yeah?

    you want clubs let in on 'merit'?

    hahahha, here comes our Lefty mate Member again.
    have you got that full back tattoo of Bob Brown finished yet?
    Quote Originally Posted by MFKS View Post
    And I don't argue with FR. The bloke is a legend and deserves great praise for his contributions to football in the Hunter.
    He is also the second best poster on the entire Foz behind you
    Quote Originally Posted by parksey View Post
    sometimes there's more to life than just winning
    Quote Originally Posted by ForeverRed View Post
    What a deadset ****ing coward **** you are
    Quote Originally Posted by MFKS View Post
    Seems like I am WRONG

  6. #1306
    infant member plague's Avatar
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    and i was under the impression that even though the A-League will be 'run' day to day under its own leadership, the FFA has final say on any sort of promotion/relegation and expansion yeah?
    Quote Originally Posted by MFKS View Post
    And I don't argue with FR. The bloke is a legend and deserves great praise for his contributions to football in the Hunter.
    He is also the second best poster on the entire Foz behind you
    Quote Originally Posted by parksey View Post
    sometimes there's more to life than just winning
    Quote Originally Posted by ForeverRed View Post
    What a deadset ****ing coward **** you are
    Quote Originally Posted by MFKS View Post
    Seems like I am WRONG

  7. #1307
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    Quote Originally Posted by plague View Post
    the flipside to that is the fear of pissing away your licence fee by fielding a shit team. Hence owners may try harder if they have more to lose.
    prob why Aston Martin owners look after their cars better than blokes with a Datsun 120Y yeah?

    you want clubs let in on 'merit'?

    hahahha, here comes our Lefty mate Member again.
    have you got that full back tattoo of Bob Brown finished yet?
    But look on the brightside

    This is the same organisation who bitched to high heavens about Fifa and Qatar buying the World Cup in a bidding process

    Then they go set up this farce where they get paid a licence fee to decide on who gets into the comp in what would have to be one of the least transparent processes of all time and is ripe for them to show off all that has been learned from Sepp Platini and co throygh the ages

    Not exactly a good look for an organisation whom is trying to be more democratic and transparent

    So the hypocrisy is out of this world

    I wonder how many paper bags will change hands from the winning bidders??

  8. #1308
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    Quote Originally Posted by MFKS View Post
    Disagree that we dont have the talent for 15 to 20 teams.

    Plemty of blokes are stuck in the NPL and just never get given the opportunity due to the current model

    Look at our side for example
    Vujica
    Jackson
    Thurgate
    Cowburn.

    None of these blokes are certain starters in our side but they are more than capable of being involved at HAL level

    You put 20 teams in the League and thet start getting opportunities as starters not fighting for scraps like we have in a 9 team league where each club wastes 5 spots on Foreigners


    Disagree also on the kids coming through thing too

    If this was accurate we would have 5 bays of 16 year old active hooligans if this was the case

    HAL model hasnt worked

    It is just as broken as the NSL was with different failings
    Exactly. Arzani hadn't played Snr football 12 months ago. Dennis Genreau wasn't deemed good enough to get any time at Melb City but plays week in week out in the Eredivisie. There's plenty of talent about just not getting a chance

  9. #1309
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hunter403 View Post
    Appreciate your views and I can see where you are coming from.

    If we halved the figure in an effort to get 20 teams as you suggest, can we extrapolate that all players would take a 50% pay cut? If we do, do you think the likes of Petratos, Ugar and any number of better A league players would be here, or would they be off to some other Asian league where they can earn a lot more than here? What would the standard of your 20 team comp be like when every kid that wants more than $25k to play football (live on) packs his bag for India, Malaysia etc? Would supporters go? Would it get tv coverage?

    Again, not taking the pi55, just seeking your views.
    The big thing I agree with the Member on is regarding the PFA. They're a selfish ****ing blight on the game. Blokes like Dimi and Ugarkovic would get paid their market worth as they're good players. I have no issue with the Salary Cap at its current level but I ****ing hate that clubs are forced to have a minimum spend which is bloody close to the cap and the minimum salary being $60k. The PFA have ****ed growth and young players with those two. It's why dead weight like BK and Hoole get paid 6 figure sums at a club that can't get anyone else to go there. Instead of a club loosing cash being able to consolidate, give some kids a chance on bugger all coin and make money selling them. You get mercenary players like Reddy playing at 8 clubs in a 10 team league.

  10. #1310
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Camel View Post
    The big thing I agree with the Member on is regarding the PFA. They're a selfish ****ing blight on the game. Blokes like Dimi and Ugarkovic would get paid their market worth as they're good players. I have no issue with the Salary Cap at its current level but I ****ing hate that clubs are forced to have a minimum spend which is bloody close to the cap and the minimum salary being $60k. The PFA have ****ed growth and young players with those two. It's why dead weight like BK and Hoole get paid 6 figure sums at a club that can't get anyone else to go there. Instead of a club loosing cash being able to consolidate, give some kids a chance on bugger all coin and make money selling them. You get mercenary players like Reddy playing at 8 clubs in a 10 team league.
    Lachy Wales was was getting something like 40 bucks a week at the Gypos last year
    Quote Originally Posted by lquiquer View Post
    Welcome to the circus ... And I can't argue any of your points... In contention for best first post of the year... ��


    Quote Originally Posted by parksey View Post
    love at first sight

  11. #1311
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Camel View Post
    It's why dead weight like BK and Hoole get paid 6 figure sums at a club that can't get anyone else to go there.
    nah.
    its cheap ass owners hiring bum ass CEO's who sign blokes like that to deals like that.

    You blokes think i am kidding with my Middleby talk.
    bloke made some absolutely terrible decisions on behalf of the club.

    none of them were the PFA's fault.
    Quote Originally Posted by MFKS View Post
    And I don't argue with FR. The bloke is a legend and deserves great praise for his contributions to football in the Hunter.
    He is also the second best poster on the entire Foz behind you
    Quote Originally Posted by parksey View Post
    sometimes there's more to life than just winning
    Quote Originally Posted by ForeverRed View Post
    What a deadset ****ing coward **** you are
    Quote Originally Posted by MFKS View Post
    Seems like I am WRONG

  12. #1312
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Camel View Post
    The big thing I agree with the Member on is regarding the PFA. They're a selfish ****ing blight on the game. Blokes like Dimi and Ugarkovic would get paid their market worth as they're good players. I have no issue with the Salary Cap at its current level but I ****ing hate that clubs are forced to have a minimum spend which is bloody close to the cap and the minimum salary being $60k. The PFA have ****ed growth and young players with those two. It's why dead weight like BK and Hoole get paid 6 figure sums at a club that can't get anyone else to go there. Instead of a club loosing cash being able to consolidate, give some kids a chance on bugger all coin and make money selling them. You get mercenary players like Reddy playing at 8 clubs in a 10 team league.
    How would you determine a players value ? Goals ? Assists? Evades ? Memberships ? Marketing potential ?

    I'm not being critical of you here but it's rare to find any sector of the labour market offering pay / salary based on anything other than the workers ability at the bargaining table.
    It's not optimal, but it's unfortunately how it works.
    This is why I think publishing player salaries like they do in the MLS is a far more effective and efficient approach.
    Last edited by The Dunster; 23-11-2018 at 04:01 AM.

  13. #1313
    infant member plague's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Dunster View Post
    This is why I think publishing player salaries like they do in the MLS is a far more effective and efficient approach.
    As much as this helps protect the integrity of a salary capped sport, not sure if it will help keep wages under control.

    Managers (who are only doing their job) can point to cashed up asian and gulf clubs as a means of leverage.
    and there is always a Middleby around to take the bait.

    Esp for a young hyped 'talent' like an Arzani, if he hits the open market, everyone wont care what the other young talent are getting paid if they really want him.

    The Jets management is solely responsible for us having 2 x six figure keepers on the books back bn in the day.
    They should never have let it happen.

    Hopefully though the new A-league management open up transfers between clubs in order to help teams and hopefully spread talent as well.

  14. #1314
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    Quote Originally Posted by plague View Post
    As much as this helps protect the integrity of a salary capped sport, not sure if it will help keep wages under control.

    Managers (who are only doing their job) can point to cashed up asian and gulf clubs as a means of leverage.
    and there is always a Middleby around to take the bait.

    Esp for a young hyped 'talent' like an Arzani, if he hits the open market, everyone wont care what the other young talent are getting paid if they really want him.

    The Jets management is solely responsible for us having 2 x six figure keepers on the books back bn in the day.
    They should never have let it happen.

    Hopefully though the new A-league management open up transfers between clubs in order to help teams and hopefully spread talent as well.
    The main reason markets fail is asymmetric information. Publishing wages data lessens this problem.

    It would also check ridiculous transactions like those Middleby made as others would have enough information to show it was not an optimal decision.

    This is precisely why lenders do credit checks and Insurers have access to databases with respect to medical, crime, driving records... and can even cross reference what you paid previously with other insurers or if you sought a loan elsewhere and failed.

    Without this information they simply could not charge customers the correct premiums. Football clubs without full information can't pay optimal wages.

    It's got nothing to do with the salary cap.
    Last edited by The Dunster; 23-11-2018 at 09:41 AM.

  15. #1315
    infant member plague's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Dunster View Post
    It would also check ridiculous transactions like those Middleby made as others would have enough information to show it was not an optimal decision.
    Middleby paid fair market value for both BK and Biraz.
    No amount of published information would have prevented him from signing TWO high priced keepers in a salary capped league.

    Because that's what he did.

    Again, the theory in the textbooks may be legit, but humans are stupid, you gotta account for that.

  16. #1316
    infant member plague's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Dunster View Post
    Without this information they simply could not charge customers the correct premiums.
    Wait, are you inferring that financial institutions are using this information for the benefit of the 'customer'?

  17. #1317
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    Quote Originally Posted by plague View Post
    Middleby paid fair market value for both BK and Biraz.
    No amount of published information would have prevented him from signing TWO high priced keepers in a salary capped league.

    Because that's what he did.

    Again, the theory in the textbooks may be legit, but humans are stupid, you gotta account for that.
    It's empirical Plague not a vague text book model. it's why a lot of businesses gag employees talking about salaries.

    I'm not denying that the rational agent is a textbook myth so yes - given the same information people will act differently.

    However, it would provide enough of a check/balance for someone to say to Middleby you are offering too much based on what so and so is being paid.
    Last edited by The Dunster; 23-11-2018 at 10:13 AM.

  18. #1318
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    Quote Originally Posted by plague View Post
    Wait, are you inferring that financial institutions are using this information for the benefit of the 'customer'?
    Correct in their eyes - not the customers.

  19. #1319
    Senior Member StannyCFCJET's Avatar
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    We had two first team keepers so ofcourse they were both on 6 figures

  20. #1320
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    Quote Originally Posted by plague View Post
    As much as this helps protect the integrity of a salary capped sport, not sure if it will help keep wages under control.

    Managers (who are only doing their job) can point to cashed up asian and gulf clubs as a means of leverage.
    and there is always a Middleby around to take the bait.

    Esp for a young hyped 'talent' like an Arzani, if he hits the open market, everyone wont care what the other young talent are getting paid if they really want him.

    The Jets management is solely responsible for us having 2 x six figure keepers on the books back bn in the day.
    They should never have let it happen.

    Hopefully though the new A-league management open up transfers between clubs in order to help teams and hopefully spread talent as well.
    But if you have a look at it a lot of the things in the HAL are not first world practice

    Salary Cap
    Minimum wage spend
    No Transfers between clubs
    No Promotion No Relegation
    Creating of teams through a franchise process etc etc

    How about we acknowledge that 1 other country the USA does this crap with their football comp and we start smashing these things to pieces and start joining real world practices and set our football up as per world standards??

    It is a farce that we are running most of these communist concepts in our league when the reality is we dont need them

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