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Thread: What now For Skip Football- The way ahead

  1. #21
    infant member plague's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MFKS View Post
    That being said Marcelo and Pique to me aint that great at the pure art of defending
    yeah but what is 'the pure art' of defending?

    i think the strategy is to produce footballers, who then get adapted into positions, rather than concentrating a 9 year old into being a lumbering oaf.

    All of these squads are made up of the best kids in the kickaround comp anyway, they were all the kids who could weave through everyone and score. through natural selection some have had to play in defense. because at training, there is generally an even better kid who can score goals.

    trust me those kids are pretty quick to decide if they wanna go back and score 20 goals a game in shits and giggles or adapt to a different position in a much better environment.
    Quote Originally Posted by MFKS View Post
    And I don't argue with FR. The bloke is a legend and deserves great praise for his contributions to football in the Hunter.
    He is also the second best poster on the entire Foz behind you
    Quote Originally Posted by parksey View Post
    sometimes there's more to life than just winning
    Quote Originally Posted by ForeverRed View Post
    What a deadset ****ing coward **** you are
    Quote Originally Posted by MFKS View Post
    Seems like I am WRONG

  2. #22
    Senior Member MFKS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by plague View Post
    yeah but what is 'the pure art' of defending?

    i think the strategy is to produce footballers, who then get adapted into positions, rather than concentrating a 9 year old into being a lumbering oaf.

    All of these squads are made up of the best kids in the kickaround comp anyway, they were all the kids who could weave through everyone and score. through natural selection some have had to play in defense. because at training, there is generally an even better kid who can score goals.

    trust me those kids are pretty quick to decide if they wanna go back and score 20 goals a game in shits and giggles or adapt to a different position in a much better environment.
    Pure art of defending

    By that i mean the artform of defending


    Marcelo is a great attacking weapon as a Fullback

    Defensively though I wouldnt say he was great serviceable at best

    His defending isnt getting him selected though is it??


    This idea to produce footballers who can adapt is where we are going wrong

    This is why people.put Jacob Pepper at RB and Turn Hoffman into a RB bacause he shit up front etc
    It doesnt really work

    Look at the HAL sides

    Right Back isnt a position we should have problem filling from the 9 clubs

    Best we can come up with is Josh Risdon FFS


    If Georgevski hadnt been capped by Macos he walks into aWC


    This is one reason we struggle

    Pick players appropriately by there skills at 14/15/16 and get them into their position

    Not try making something out of one when they 20/22 years old and not working out at HAL level
    Quote Originally Posted by plague View Post

    Double-eff-aye should introduce a 3rd division and dump these ice addict welfare living scumbags straight there. dont even let them get their stink anywhere near 2nd division.

  3. #23
    Senior Member StannyCFCJET's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MFKS View Post
    Pure art of defending

    By that i mean the artform of defending


    Marcelo is a great attacking weapon as a Fullback

    Defensively though I wouldnt say he was great serviceable at best

    His defending isnt getting him selected though is it??


    This idea to produce footballers who can adapt is where we are going wrong

    This is why people.put Jacob Pepper at RB and Turn Hoffman into a RB bacause he shit up front etc
    It doesnt really work

    Look at the HAL sides

    Right Back isnt a position we should have problem filling from the 9 clubs

    Best we can come up with is Josh Risdon FFS


    If Georgevski hadnt been capped by Macos he walks into aWC


    This is one reason we struggle

    Pick players appropriately by there skills at 14/15/16 and get them into their position

    Not try making something out of one when they 20/22 years old and not working out at HAL level
    Hoffman is a good Aleague RB though
    Quote Originally Posted by lquiquer View Post
    Welcome to the circus ... And I can't argue any of your points... In contention for best first post of the year... ��


    Quote Originally Posted by parksey View Post
    love at first sight

  4. #24
    Senior Member MFKS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by StannyCFCJET View Post
    Hoffman is a good Aleague RB though
    When we are sending Josh Risdon to a WC on the basis he is better than the likes of Hoffman then you are only just reiterating my point

    It isnt good enough
    Quote Originally Posted by plague View Post

    Double-eff-aye should introduce a 3rd division and dump these ice addict welfare living scumbags straight there. dont even let them get their stink anywhere near 2nd division.

  5. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by MFKS View Post
    Pure art of defending

    By that i mean the artform of defending
    Hello to you as well.

  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by StannyCFCJET View Post
    Hoffman is a good Aleague RB though
    No he is not, He played the best football of his entire HAL career away from that position. What more obvious evidence do you need than this past season to highlight that. Bloke is a average RB on a good day.

    Too further add to that i would almost bet my left one that when the sheep shaggers from across the ditch came calling making an offer it would NOT have been with RB in mind based on what they had seen from him further up the park.
    Last edited by 380; 30-06-2018 at 10:32 PM.

  7. #27
    Senior Member StannyCFCJET's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 380 View Post
    No he is not, He played the best football of his entire HAL career away from that position. What more obvious evidence do you need than this past season to highlight that. Bloke is a average RB on a good day.

    Too further add to that i would almost bet my left one that when the sheep shaggers from across the ditch came calling making an offer it would NOT have been with RB in mind based on what they had seen from him further up the park.
    Ive seen enough to stick to my opinion so no point continuing this argument
    Quote Originally Posted by lquiquer View Post
    Welcome to the circus ... And I can't argue any of your points... In contention for best first post of the year... ��


    Quote Originally Posted by parksey View Post
    love at first sight

  8. #28
    Senior Member MFKS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by plague View Post

    Double-eff-aye should introduce a 3rd division and dump these ice addict welfare living scumbags straight there. dont even let them get their stink anywhere near 2nd division.

  9. #29
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    Good article.
    Fox got Arzani in the team, maybe they can get some good systems in play.

  10. #30
    Senior Member MFKS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bremsstrahlung View Post
    Good article.
    Fox got Arzani in the team, maybe they can get some good systems in play.
    Fox also got Ange to quit qnd Arnie into NT manager

    If they could go after Lowy and Gallop and rid us of thgem and get promotion and relegation happening they be on track
    Quote Originally Posted by plague View Post

    Double-eff-aye should introduce a 3rd division and dump these ice addict welfare living scumbags straight there. dont even let them get their stink anywhere near 2nd division.

  11. #31
    infant member plague's Avatar
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    FINALLY!!!!!!!

    Captain Obvious' identity is revealed.
    Quote Originally Posted by MFKS View Post
    And I don't argue with FR. The bloke is a legend and deserves great praise for his contributions to football in the Hunter.
    He is also the second best poster on the entire Foz behind you
    Quote Originally Posted by parksey View Post
    sometimes there's more to life than just winning
    Quote Originally Posted by ForeverRed View Post
    What a deadset ****ing coward **** you are
    Quote Originally Posted by MFKS View Post
    Seems like I am WRONG

  12. #32
    Senior Member Jetmaster's Avatar
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    We are starting to see the results of this "play for fun" mentality.
    Kids don't know how to win and can't understand adversity in this new age.

  13. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jetmaster View Post
    We are starting to see the results of this "play for fun" mentality.
    Kids don't know how to win and can't understand adversity in this new age.
    True - Though I wouldn't like to see it go back to how it was when I played either with no yellow cards and pretty much free licence to do whatever was required to get the win.
    But I also think it was under those conditions that we learned how to tough it out.
    Technically we were shit compared to kids today - even the lower division kids these days were better than rep players from my day as far as dribbling / ball control goes.
    All we really had over them was being mentally stronger. We didn't get rattled / upset as easily and when we did we would take out an opposition player in a calculated way more so than simply lose the plot like you see these days.

  14. #34
    Senior Member MFKS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jetmaster View Post
    We are starting to see the results of this "play for fun" mentality.
    Kids don't know how to win and can't understand adversity in this new age.
    It is also evident in the kids coming through the system trying to make it as professional footballers

    Reality it us a dog eat dog world for them.

    The HAL clubs are not producing kids with sufficient spine for a fight

    You can see this when the kids fall back to the NPL system
    You just dont see enough of them come back and dominate

    They may have the skills but they dont have the fight and work rate required

    HAL clubs are failing to produce enough players coming through as they treat it as a joke
    Quote Originally Posted by plague View Post

    Double-eff-aye should introduce a 3rd division and dump these ice addict welfare living scumbags straight there. dont even let them get their stink anywhere near 2nd division.

  15. #35
    infant member plague's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jetmaster View Post
    We are starting to see the results of this "play for fun" mentality.
    Kids don't know how to win and can't understand adversity in this new age.
    i nea is there any sort of evidence to support this theory.

    because it sounds fairly selective.

    and i think they said that about the 'generation x kids' (they were all slackers.
    and the Gen Y kids (they were all entitled).
    and now they are saying it about those dang Millenials.

    successful people gonna be successful, in all walks of life.
    ill def concede the definition of success has changed, but thats generally on the individual to aim for.
    Quote Originally Posted by MFKS View Post
    And I don't argue with FR. The bloke is a legend and deserves great praise for his contributions to football in the Hunter.
    He is also the second best poster on the entire Foz behind you
    Quote Originally Posted by parksey View Post
    sometimes there's more to life than just winning
    Quote Originally Posted by ForeverRed View Post
    What a deadset ****ing coward **** you are
    Quote Originally Posted by MFKS View Post
    Seems like I am WRONG

  16. #36
    infant member plague's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MFKS View Post

    They may have the skills but they dont have the fight and work rate required

    HAL clubs are failing to produce enough players coming through as they treat it as a joke
    agian, going back to the SAP program. winning, and scores and results arent recorded by the association.
    the reason behind this is that once again, as 9 year olds, their first touch and basic football skills are paramount.
    the classic example is one club in particular having a reputation within the coaches of being overly physical and direct. this club wins many games but the football is garbage and the kids will get found out sooner rather than later.

    now, having said that.

    EVERY coach in the program is keeping score, EVERY kid is keeping score during the games, and they are desperately playing to win.
    its no surprise though that the 4 best performing clubs in every metric so far have been winning the majority of their games, and developing a style of play that is really cool to watch. but in my observation I've never heard one coach from the 4 clubs EVER talk to their team mid match about if they were winning or losing.

    people who want to do this for a living wont need any help developing the attitude to want to win.
    the hope is that when they get that attitude, they have the skills and knowledge to do something about it.
    Quote Originally Posted by MFKS View Post
    And I don't argue with FR. The bloke is a legend and deserves great praise for his contributions to football in the Hunter.
    He is also the second best poster on the entire Foz behind you
    Quote Originally Posted by parksey View Post
    sometimes there's more to life than just winning
    Quote Originally Posted by ForeverRed View Post
    What a deadset ****ing coward **** you are
    Quote Originally Posted by MFKS View Post
    Seems like I am WRONG

  17. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by plague View Post
    agian, going back to the SAP program. winning, and scores and results arent recorded by the association.
    the reason behind this is that once again, as 9 year olds, their first touch and basic football skills are paramount.
    the classic example is one club in particular having a reputation within the coaches of being overly physical and direct. this club wins many games but the football is garbage and the kids will get found out sooner rather than later.

    now, having said that.

    EVERY coach in the program is keeping score, EVERY kid is keeping score during the games, and they are desperately playing to win.
    its no surprise though that the 4 best performing clubs in every metric so far have been winning the majority of their games, and developing a style of play that is really cool to watch. but in my observation I've never heard one coach from the 4 clubs EVER talk to their team mid match about if they were winning or losing.

    people who want to do this for a living wont need any help developing the attitude to want to win.
    the hope is that when they get that attitude, they have the skills and knowledge to do something about it.
    Most people don't really change attitude / personality wise after the ages of eight or nine years of age. So it's probably best to get the thinking / mentality right early otherwise it rarely develops later on.
    Skills wise - you really don't need to do it that early be it sports, musical instruments... whatever. Muscle memory can be developed easily enough well into and beyond your teens. Changing peoples attitudes / personalities though is very difficult if not impossible even with early teens.

    All the technical efficiency in the world doesn't mean shit if you don't think like a winner - and most of these academy kids - especially the ones who over compensate with the skills / technical stuff can be very easily sorted out.
    What eventuates is they become too reliant upon a system / network around them and when they have to face adversity they essentially shit themselves.

    There are exceptions but it's rare - I'm not limiting this to football either.
    Last edited by The Dunster; 01-07-2018 at 07:54 PM.

  18. #38
    Senior Member MFKS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by plague View Post
    agian, going back to the SAP program. winning, and scores and results arent recorded by the association.
    the reason behind this is that once again, as 9 year olds, their first touch and basic football skills are paramount.
    the classic example is one club in particular having a reputation within the coaches of being overly physical and direct. this club wins many games but the football is garbage and the kids will get found out sooner rather than later.

    now, having said that.

    EVERY coach in the program is keeping score, EVERY kid is keeping score during the games, and they are desperately playing to win.
    its no surprise though that the 4 best performing clubs in every metric so far have been winning the majority of their games, and developing a style of play that is really cool to watch. but in my observation I've never heard one coach from the 4 clubs EVER talk to their team mid match about if they were winning or losing.

    people who want to do this for a living wont need any help developing the attitude to want to win.
    the hope is that when they get that attitude, they have the skills and knowledge to do something about it.
    Disagree you want to see this non competitve attitude then go watch the EJ play and see how this shit attitude manifests

    Those kids have the talent. That isnt in dispute
    When they play well and get on top they tend to win well

    When the opposition gets into the game. They dont have the fight in them to suceed

    That why they lose

    It also why so many of them are failing to break through into the HAL

    They are not being taught how to win
    They are not being taught how to scrap
    They are not being taught how to fight

    They are proof that being a winner ls ingrained in you at a young age and this no score crap doesnt work
    Quote Originally Posted by plague View Post

    Double-eff-aye should introduce a 3rd division and dump these ice addict welfare living scumbags straight there. dont even let them get their stink anywhere near 2nd division.

  19. #39
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    Few questions for those with kiddies.

    1. What age does SAP stop? At what age is it full field?
    2. Do SAP teams train?
    3. What do you have to do to coach SAP?
    4. At what age do kids start being “selected” or graded

  20. #40
    infant member plague's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bremsstrahlung View Post
    Few questions for those with kiddies.

    1. What age does SAP stop? At what age is it full field?
    2. Do SAP teams train?
    3. What do you have to do to coach SAP?
    4. At what age do kids start being “selected” or graded
    1. SAP is a new program introduced this year starting at U/9. Each club has 2 teams of 9 players. The reasons for the new program are varied and boring, but there was a lot of emphasis on making the clubs responsible for the kids instead of these satellite programs that cost parents a lot of money and are more ingrained in the politics of the system. SAP is supposed to be the program implemented each year at U/9 and taken all the way through to kids make 1st grade NBN level. The best players along the way will get funnelled into the emerging Jets and hopefully to higher honours. At the moment its 7 players on the park (using a half pitch). It is a bit unclear when they go to full field, but either 10's or 11's each club merges their teams into one full squad of 16/17 players and goes full field.

    2. SAP teams train 2 x a week. Once at their home ground and once at the 5 a side facility at Speers Pt. At Speers pt each team has its own court and the NNSW/FFA coaches are there to observe the coaching technique of the kids. The drills the kids do are all the same for each team and emphasis is placed on getting the coaches doing it correctly and passing down the correct knowledge. The NNSW coaches are really approachable to give feedback to the parents about the system. Ive been impressed.

    3. This is the big difference in performance so far. Our club has 2 ex-players (high level) coaching. they take it very seriously and are on the ball with the cirriculum and their implementation of it. there are def times where their old school instinct disagrees with whats being done, but they always defer to the program. They are both doing extra seminars (as well as the FFA mandated stuff) to better themselves. Plague Jnr is def lucky to have those blokes in charge. Other teams out there have a bunch of dads doing their best and its pretty sad. Id hate to be a parent seeing the lack of effort on the part of some clubs. its frustrating.

    4. The kids in SAP are pulled from each clubs pool of existing juniors, and any other kids of that age that want to trial. Trials were held back in August and our club had about 120 kids show up. Some kids trialled at a bunch of clubs in order to get a spot. So some were selected but then declined as they had a 'better offer'. I think all of our kids ended up being from the clubs junior program. Our club has vowed to keep it local but at the end of this season (september) trials will start again for U/10's and it will be interesting to see if the club wants to sign 'better' players or remain loyal. there a re 4 strong clubs in Newcastle and without doubt the best kids from the 'lesser' clubs will come trial with the big clubs. It will def bring the talent into a more concentrated area, which has good and bad connotations.
    Quote Originally Posted by MFKS View Post
    And I don't argue with FR. The bloke is a legend and deserves great praise for his contributions to football in the Hunter.
    He is also the second best poster on the entire Foz behind you
    Quote Originally Posted by parksey View Post
    sometimes there's more to life than just winning
    Quote Originally Posted by ForeverRed View Post
    What a deadset ****ing coward **** you are
    Quote Originally Posted by MFKS View Post
    Seems like I am WRONG

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