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Thread: 2022 NPL Youth thread

  1. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by KITZ View Post
    Get off the koolaide. I’m specifically talking about behaviour and if the standard was set then the players wouldn’t have even attempted to put on such an Performance to begin with, let alone the name calling etc after the game.

    Let’s face it no one who was there cares about the rambling crap you added after; they represented the club and thats what they sold to everyone there at the time.

    Also Angus thurgate was playing NPL up here at 15 I’m pretty sure. God it gets old all those tall poppies out there who think because they or their kid didn’t do something that no kid ever will.

    **** me it gets boring hearing that same old crap.
    no one who was there? Sorry, must be mistaken - Im not aware of any particular incident nor am I referring to one. The only name calling I have experienced was an NPL coach berating NL1 players, officials, and referees after they were beaten in a trial - on most occasions, but usually just the one club tbh.

    To be fair there were also as many npl clubs/officials and players that were fine being beaten by a lower graded side.

    As for any incident you're referring to above, I have no idea - I was responding to sapdad and just giving my experience that I have thought the standard of program at NL recently, and not too long ago at South Cardiff (Cant comment on now) rivalled the better NPL setups and were certainly better than the mid to lower NPL setups. Sorry it upset you so much to hear my lived experience.

  2. #22
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    Season hasn’t even started.

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    Usually found New Lambton parents to be the worst but the players act entirely differently which is a good things.

    In terms of NL1 teams beating NPL clubs, yes it does happen and indeed happened this past weekend. The sooner Northern separate the youth comps from the seniors into three tiers with promotion and relegation the better it will be for all the players. And actually force struggling NPL clubs to improve what they provide.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Goatscheese View Post
    Usually found New Lambton parents to be the worst but the players act entirely differently which is a good things.

    In terms of NL1 teams beating NPL clubs, yes it does happen and indeed happened this past weekend. The sooner Northern separate the youth comps from the seniors into three tiers with promotion and relegation the better it will be for all the players. And actually force struggling NPL clubs to improve what they provide.
    I wonder if that's what will happen or if kids just move every year to the team that goes up from the team that goes down - I think cooks coming in is an example, mostly they all just shuffled around again for the most part.

    In regards to my previous response, I know I got a bit frustrated but I hate that we write off (or speak about) our developing players like that constantly, how can we expect more from them if we have written them off right from the start, we need to change the conversation around football development in the area. The recipe for success exists but players are just either working it out on their own or falling into it, most of it is up to parents who have to work out the system really quickly or make the right connections or just hope for sheer luck that they are doing the right things. I think there are things that we can do as parents / volunteers / members of the football community to help things change for the better - one of those is passing on knowledge to parents who are just coming through the system in JDL, we assume that everyone knows football, but the reality is not all parents understand the landscape of football development and maybe there are kids missing out because of it.

    anyway, lets at least hope they get a full season this year - that would be a great start!

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    Quote Originally Posted by KITZ View Post
    I wonder if that's what will happen or if kids just move every year to the team that goes up from the team that goes down - I think cooks coming in is an example, mostly they all just shuffled around again for the most part.
    And that might happen, but I can't imagine whole teams switching between the promoted and relegated ones, particularly if the tiers are now tighter in competition. Big different going from best of 8 to now play against only 7 teams which you're competitive against compared to joining a group of 13 of which half you're not competitive against.

  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Goatscheese View Post
    And that might happen, but I can't imagine whole teams switching between the promoted and relegated ones, particularly if the tiers are now tighter in competition. Big different going from best of 8 to now play against only 7 teams which you're competitive against compared to joining a group of 13 of which half you're not competitive against.
    De-coupling the youth should also happen in line with a competition re-shuffle.

    There are a possible 24 teams (including Mid Coast, Nth Coast and Nth Inland).

    3 groups of 8 with club championship pro/rel seems like a no brainer.

    Realistically a few teams should not be required to field Jr's and you could get away with 2 groups of 10 or 11.
    All opinions expressed here are my own.

    "Tell me and I forget. Teach me and I remember. Involve me and I learn." -Benjamin Franklin

  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aegon View Post
    De-coupling the youth should also happen in line with a competition re-shuffle.

    There are a possible 24 teams (including Mid Coast, Nth Coast and Nth Inland).

    3 groups of 8 with club championship pro/rel seems like a no brainer.

    Realistically a few teams should not be required to field Jr's and you could get away with 2 groups of 10 or 11.
    Well look seniors could be rehuffled as well.

    If you can get 22 clubs, then have three groups of 7. Top 2 promoted every week.

    I'd certainly ensure that Youth and Senior performance is separate though I would say the only way to get promoted from the bottom side is if you have all youth teams. If you don't then you remain in Div 3

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    Quote Originally Posted by Goatscheese View Post

    I'd certainly ensure that Youth and Senior performance is separate though I would say the only way to get promoted from the bottom side is if you have all youth teams. If you don't then you remain in Div 3
    Only hitch there is that a club might have a great 14s and no 15s. Penalizing the kids.
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  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jim View Post
    Only hitch there is that a club might have a great 14s and no 15s. Penalizing the kids.
    I was talking about seniors moving through. Since the youth should be on a club championship basis.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Singlespeed View Post
    Firstly, every parent in NL1 I have spoken too (not heaps to be honest) say they would leave the club if promoted.....they want to be in NL1 for many reasons. (See Cooks Hill this year for example - of reports are true).
    I also see a lot of kids leaving NL1 every year to go to NPL clubs, not just to "say they are playing in NPL", but also because they need a challenge. Clubs do a lot of work developing kids and then NPL clubs come and poach them, because they need a challenge and sometimes the attraction is "you get to be an NPL player".

    I can see why some Cooks Hills players left, because they go from NL1 to a large NPL league. But if it was broken up into three tiers. You could be top and then you're moving up to a smaller tier and against a closer range of teams that you're competitive against. Not into a large league where you will struggle bad for half the season.

    Secondly with the amount of player movements it would make no difference - similar to the above point, but the same players would just move.
    Some may move, some may not, I would hope the club would show loyalty to most of the players should they be promoted.

    Thirdly, it would probably promote a club to win rather than develop (which is probably happening too much now). This would happen especially in the last half of the season if near the top of lower league or bottom of upper league. Winning does not necessarily mean you have a program that is best for the kids development. Along with this point would be that recruitment would be more important than development also.
    While also a concern see above about NL1 clubs developing players only to lose them and having to start again, hard to develop club loyalty and to have feeder teams for your seniors.

    We currently see some clubs with teams that have been down the bottom of the NPL for years, do they have a good development program? Would they start doing more if they knew they were threatened about going down a tier? It's not good for development for a team to sit at the bottom of a league and be thrashed almost every week. It's also not good for development or for a club for a club to remain in a lower tier no matter what they do.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Singlespeed View Post
    Firstly, every parent in NL1 I have spoken too (not heaps to be honest) say they would leave the club if promoted.....they want to be in NL1 for many reasons. (See Cooks Hill this year for example - of reports are true).
    You raise some good points,but I had no idea parents thought like this?Is this at a particular club?Id never heard this kind of talk before.It seems really backwards to me but maybe I dont get the reasoning behind it.

  12. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by sapdad View Post
    You raise some good points,but I had no idea parents thought like this?Is this at a particular club?Id never heard this kind of talk before.It seems really backwards to me but maybe I dont get the reasoning behind it.
    Cost could be one factor. Another could be the reputation of the NPL clubs and competition. Another could be that the parents have made friends at the NL1 club and enjoy the social side of things, recognising that their son won't be playing for a living. Myriad of reasons why people do what they do.
    "It is not that I am afraid to die; its just that I don't want to be there when it happens" - Woody Allen

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    Quote Originally Posted by Singlespeed View Post
    Like I said small sample size and a lot of them had come from NPL, all different reasons as mentioned above, cost, pressure, bad experience before, like winning at lower level. All valid reasons if you are good and just was to enjoy yourself.

    Agreed it is got good that clubs do nothing and keep getting beaten. But it is a hard cycle to get out of as recruitment becomes as issue. Is also a long term thing to turn around, almost takes a whole development cycle (JDL through to 16's) if doing a good and consistent job.

    I am not sure NNSW can sustain NPL and NL1 in youth, maybe just not enough kids/talent to make up 24 teams.
    Hence reduce it to 21 teams and split it up to 3 groups of 7. Have promotion relegation so clubs that are building up can be rewarded, and clubs not building up don't get to stay in the top league simply because of who they were when it got changed.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Singlespeed View Post
    I am not against that idea (or any idea actually). The only issue I see with promotion relegation (at youth level), is that it becomes a game of:

    1. Recruitment.
    2. Playing to win.
    This happens now to an extent.

    What do they do in South Australia, they seem to get a lot of young players up into the seniors?
    No idea, coming from Melbourne I can tell you that they have promotion and relegation and Sydney also have changed it around and also will have promotion and relegation. South Australia may do the same thing.

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    Maitland v lakes trials

    13s 11-1
    14s - 5-0
    15s - 6-0
    16s - 2-0

  16. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by KITZ View Post
    Maitland v lakes trials

    13s 11-1
    14s - 5-0
    15s - 6-0
    16s - 2-0
    Ouch. Long season ahead for Lakes again.
    "It is not that I am afraid to die; its just that I don't want to be there when it happens" - Woody Allen

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hunter403 View Post
    Ouch. Long season ahead for Lakes again.
    The 16's was a good game to watch, being that it stayed nil all for 3 quarters of the game. Their 18s did beat Maitland 18's, but for Maitland it was their first trial game for the season. they do develop through as they get older at lakes but it is a hard slog and without metrics other than score its hard to gauge if the program is successful in regards to what it is trying to achieve. If you look at the 16s game last night lakes had 2 14's playing but Maitland had 3 as well.

  18. #38
    Senior Member Hunter403's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by KITZ View Post
    The 16's was a good game to watch, being that it stayed nil all for 3 quarters of the game. Their 18s did beat Maitland 18's, but for Maitland it was their first trial game for the season. they do develop through as they get older at lakes but it is a hard slog and without metrics other than score its hard to gauge if the program is successful in regards to what it is trying to achieve. If you look at the 16s game last night lakes had 2 14's playing but Maitland had 3 as well.
    Well I wish them well. The more competitive teams, the better for everyone.
    "It is not that I am afraid to die; its just that I don't want to be there when it happens" - Woody Allen

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    Im not sure why,maybe covid related but Cooks Hill were the last team to trial.We had our sons name down but hed already picked up a spot at another club weeks before Cooks Hill even trialled.If they were lacking players then they were in a tough position to be able to fill in squads.Hopefully its a one off but a sad way to start their time in NPL.

  20. #40
    Quote Originally Posted by sapdad View Post
    Im not sure why,maybe covid related but Cooks Hill were the last team to trial.We had our sons name down but hed already picked up a spot at another club weeks before Cooks Hill even trialled.If they were lacking players then they were in a tough position to be able to fill in squads.Hopefully its a one off but a sad way to start their time in NPL.
    Sounds like the players pulled the plug late on. It's done now.

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