2023 Premier Youth League

[Taffy]

By the 16s clubs will take just about anyone just to fill the squads.
In fact anyone who stays at the same JDL PYL NPL club would be unique.

I can think of quite a few now in 18s/Reserves who have been at the same club since they started in U13s.

I know a couple who are still at the same club since U9s in U14s (the first cohort of JDL players).

As far as skill level goes, IMO the technical level is definitely better than the past but not sure about about physical athletic level which may have been better in decades past.

Probably because they have a larger pool, more talent, a larger desire by clubs to ensure they make better players and more kids get more games from U9s rather than a much smaller pool of players

[Aegon]

Some interesting match ups. Not sure about individual community teams and so the club they come up against all get through to Round 2. But then again NIAS., Wallsend and Charlestown all aren't fielding full teams either. So whoever gets them go through to Round 2 in those age groups.

Surely there was a better way to format this for the ID teams?
1- Pool ID clubs together in a group pool (13's-18's)
2- Play ID selective sides in each age group
3- Play Zone ID selective sides in each age group

[Taffy]

Surely there was a better way to format this for the ID teams?
1- Pool ID clubs together in a group pool (13's-18's)
2- Play ID selective sides in each age group
3- Play Zone ID selective sides in each age group

Have them enter the plate in Round 2 as well would help. Then it is only the three Northern clubs that can't field full teams where other teams go straight to the cup

[Aegon]

Interested to hear people's thoughts on NPL Youth after the second class of SAP/JDL graduates have moved into 13's.

Looking at both tables there is a pretty clear divide between the top half and bottom half of the tables.

I think I optimistically thought that developing more players earlier would result in a more balanced competition, however it looks like it has probably expanded the talent depth out to around 6 or so competitive teams in each grade.

Maybe the improvement is that there are a greater number of kids with a high level of ability, however I really don't know.

The 13's age group seems to be quite deep in terms of high quality players. There are probably another 10-15 kids that are very, very close to the level of players selected by the Jets, and the 13's Jets will be top half in NPL Youth 1 in the FNSW competition.

Do people think the club based JDL/SAP is a success so far or has it failed to meet it's objectives?

Has the NPL Youth competition benefited or not?

Does this help clubs outside of the historical elite?

[WOW2.0]

@Aegon, I think it's still too early to tell...some teams seem to have done well, others not so well..sometimes for things within their control, other times not.

I think Rosebuds decision last year to run with a single SAP group, while managing to keep that core has paid off...there 13s might be one of the big losers in the pro/rel...but quite a few of the teams are almost unrecognisable to the teams we played against over the last few years (churn and burn...and I don't think that is a good thing)

Looking back to the way it was
I think in the previous system, those zone representative teams would almost move in entirety to a club, meaning some clubs were perennial under achievers, and the tier 1 clubs benefited imensly from personal relationship management (that those clubs weren't necessarily great at developing those kids further though...I didn't pay slot of attention at the time, but believe there were large gaps in the table them as well (without the threat of kid's Pro/Rel)

With those 10-15 fringe players, I think Northern should offer a development team opportunity for them, run it the way the Jets academy did previously. I.e. take those boys, play them locally an age group up to challenge them and drive them...that would also help to spread the talent out in each age group as well IMO. Also provideing the Jets a ready source to fill any shortfall they have through the season (underperformance, injury, etc...and a place for released Jets kids to continue their development before they may be invited back)

That provides an outlet primarily for development of those kids, rather than results based drive of the tier 1s (being careful not to mistake winning for development)

[sapdad]

I think Rosebuds decision last year to run with a single SAP group, while managing to keep that core has paid off...there 13s might be one of the big losers in the pro/rel...but quite a few of the teams are almost unrecognisable to the teams we played against over the last few years (churn and burn...and I don't think that is a good thing)

The JDL program has produced a higher standard of technical ability,but it hasnt benefited clubs who developed them.Your example above if Im correct had their 2 best kids go to the superteam that was almost entirely recruited from outside their own juniors.Does that make the recruiting club succesful?Problem will be that the superclub will lose players next year to various other programs and will recruit from outside again.So the club will look good from afar from a results basis but what have they actually done to raise the standard of the whole age group?and most importantly,is it the clubs job to train the kids or just recruit?Because there is no benefit to developing is there?On the flip side the consistent top 3 youth clubs develop kids, the Jets and other higher levels come and take them and what do they get for it?Then they are forced to recruit outside their kids and everyone blames them for buying a comp.The only upside is that we stay the course,get NNSW to bring more and more kids into the JDL structure and hopefully give the clubs a reason to keep developing them.The downside is if we go back to the old system,it becomes more exclusive and we end up like the womens NPL where the top tier talent just goes to where the best deal is and walks the comp every year.The JDL system needs a good generation to even begin to get real results.Im happy to keep it going.

[Timewilltell]

@Aegon, I think it's still too early to tell...some teams seem to have done well, others not so well..sometimes for things within their control, other times not.

I think Rosebuds decision last year to run with a single SAP group, while managing to keep that core has paid off...there 13s might be one of the big losers in the pro/rel...but quite a few of the teams are almost unrecognisable to the teams we played against over the last few years (churn and burn...and I don't think that is a good thing)

Looking back to the way it was
I think in the previous system, those zone representative teams would almost move in entirety to a club, meaning some clubs were perennial under achievers, and the tier 1 clubs benefited imensly from personal relationship management (that those clubs weren't necessarily great at developing those kids further though...I didn't pay slot of attention at the time, but believe there were large gaps in the table them as well (without the threat of kid's Pro/Rel)

With those 10-15 fringe players, I think Northern should offer a development team opportunity for them, run it the way the Jets academy did previously. I.e. take those boys, play them locally an age group up to challenge them and drive them...that would also help to spread the talent out in each age group as well IMO. Also provideing the Jets a ready source to fill any shortfall they have through the season (underperformance, injury, etc...and a place for released Jets kids to continue their development before they may be invited back)

That provides an outlet primarily for development of those kids, rather than results based drive of the tier 1s (being careful not to mistake winning for development)

Most intelligent post I?ve ever read in this forum 👍👍

[Taffy]

Interested to hear people's thoughts on NPL Youth after the second class of SAP/JDL graduates have moved into 13's.

Looking at both tables there is a pretty clear divide between the top half and bottom half of the tables.

Hence why they have the split later in the year, and next year Division 1 will be smaller.

But I recall in years gone by under the old system there was a huge divide, does anyone elese remember teams with goal differences bigger than -100.

I think I optimistically thought that developing more players earlier would result in a more balanced competition, however it looks like it has probably expanded the talent depth out to around 6 or so competitive teams in each grade.

Maybe the improvement is that there are a greater number of kids with a high level of ability, however I really don't know.

Have to continue to give it some time, but also look at the changes in teams. Last year in the U13s it wasn't just all the same teams getting the top results. Olympic for example struggled in 13s, yet before they just got given the best Newcastle Football kids. Now they had to develop them. Seem to have learnt that lesson quickly with their current 13s, but Adamstown and Lakes 13s are going well and they were usually two clubs that struggled and were clubs losing by 6 or more every week. So good on Adamstown and Lakes who got the opportunity to develop their own JDL kids rather than having to take community kids who were already at a disadvantage over the SAP Zone kids (due to coaching and much smaller season) who just went to the same clubs each year.

Also remember though that this is the first year of the PYL with promotion and relegation and some clubs scared of it have decided to stack teams.

The 13's age group seems to be quite deep in terms of high quality players. There are probably another 10-15 kids that are very, very close to the level of players selected by the Jets, and the 13's Jets will be top half in NPL Youth 1 in the FNSW competition.

Do people think the club based JDL/SAP is a success so far or has it failed to meet it's objectives?

So far successful, we have a greater pool of talent, clubs are now held to a standard and to their own ability to develop kids rather than just get the best through connections with the Zone TD and/or the club telling the U12s coach he can coach the team if he brings his son and players.

Has started and is allowing other clubs to start to see improvement as well

Has the NPL Youth competition benefited or not?

So far yes but the change to promotion and relegation will continue to do that.

Does this help clubs outside of the historical elite?

Absolutely.

[Taffy]

With those 10-15 fringe players, I think Northern should offer a development team opportunity for them, run it the way the Jets academy did previously. I.e. take those boys, play them locally an age group up to challenge them and drive them...that would also help to spread the talent out in each age group as well IMO. Also provideing the Jets a ready source to fill any shortfall they have through the season (underperformance, injury, etc...and a place for released Jets kids to continue their development before they may be invited back)

Well that's what TSP is all about, I know they have dropped TSP for 12s because Jets are now doing their pre-academy but that is there.

[Taffy]

The JDL system needs a good generation to even begin to get real results.Im happy to keep it going.

Exactly right, need them all to come through not start wanting to ditch it now the first branches have sprouted.

[WOW2.0]

Well that's what TSP is all about, I know they have dropped TSP for 12s because Jets are now doing their pre-academy but that is there.

TSP isn't a team though. Arguably they are mostly just helping along those tier 1s (whose.players make up the bulk of the inclusions) by giving some of their kids an extra night to train with other quality kids (nothing wrong with that either)...my concept would be more like that TSP team forming a regular season team, competing up an age group for greater challenge (not just physically, but the speed of decision making)...with a focus less so on "winning" (that clubs especially need to be mindful of now due to the pro/rel of kids sport (adults should have this system, well before any kids teams), and more about the long term development of some of our hugely talented kids

And offers a transition step to and from the Jets

So I think what I have suggested is quite different in that regard

[Aegon]

TSP isn't a team though. Arguably they are mostly just helping along those tier 1s (whose.players make up the bulk of the inclusions) by giving some of their kids an extra night to train with other quality kids (nothing wrong with that either)...my concept would be more like that TSP team forming a regular season team, competing up an age group for greater challenge (not just physically, but the speed of decision making)...with a focus less so on "winning" (that clubs especially need to be mindful of now due to the pro/rel of kids sport (adults should have this system, well before any kids teams), and more about the long term development of some of our hugely talented kids

And offers a transition step to and from the Jets

So I think what I have suggested is quite different in that regard

I like the idea, however not sure the clubs would be sold on losing some of their best players to a Northern TSP team that may then be subject of the same relationship management that was detrimental to the zone format. Also would leave room for only 7 clubs in the Youth A division.

It would definitely expand the options and development pathways for the players though.

[WOW2.0]

I think in that system, there is no need for a tiered approach...certainly reduces the gap, as the best players would be promoted appropriately thus narrowing the margin between the top and bottom

The difference between the teams often comes down to just a couple of players, not the whole basket...

[Taffy]

I think in that system, there is no need for a tiered approach...certainly reduces the gap, as the best players would be promoted appropriately thus narrowing the margin between the top and bottom

The difference between the teams often comes down to just a couple of players, not the whole basket...

It is different as it is now what the Jets used to do before going to Sydney. So now we just create another team, though may not necessarily be the best players going into the team.

Also would leave room for only 7 clubs in the Youth A division.

That assumes they finished top 8 in Division 1. Wouldn't seem right for them to get to stay up if the finish bottom 4.


The current system does bring in about 20 players for TSP where they do play games against other zones and go to Nationals without compromising clubs. If they are good enough they will be seen by Jets and Mariners the latter of which are always scouting and looking over the competition throughout the season (one player they approached for this year told him they had been making notes about him for 3 years and felt he was now developed enough), while the former only bother to start looking towards the end of the season, which I doubt the Jets even knew this player existed.

[jessepinkman]

Does the kids rego money cover the new CEOs all expenses paid trip to Japan with the 14s???

Why does the CEO need to go on this trip at all?

[The Magician]

Does the kids rego money cover the new CEOs all expenses paid trip to Japan with the 14s???

Why does the CEO need to go on this trip at all?

Peter has been tour manager for this trip of NNSW representatives for nearly 10 years, originally NSWF and NNSWF would create a combined squad of players. But 5 years ago FNSW ceased the participation. As an A Licence coach he also coached the team for a few years when NNSWF had no TD in residence.

And maybe his ticket was booked way before Elland was ousted and the CEO position become vacant and he applied for and was successful.

Regardless of the motives the trip has become an annual occurrence for nearly a decade giving our players a football experience they will not forget.

You are obviously affilitated with the other guy that did not get the job, and the social media attacks towards Peter criticising decisions obviously made months ago speaks volumes to the saltiness of your mate not being a suitable candidate.

You and your mates are exactly what is wrong with our game and the white anting from within that never allows the game to flourish at its potential. We finally have a club person, a local administrator who has fantastic relationships with the zones and a decorated player leading our game.Who hasnt been in the job for a month, but is getting attacked that it is his fault the region doesnt have adequate representation at national and international levels for the past 14 years.

If the Ceo of Nnswf was so powerful to have input on the Jets lineup each week then you and your loser mates could justify a response. Your attacks regarding representation should be aimed at the coaches who are refusing to give our best youth a go, yet you are hell bent on criticising our new CEO for allowing our best kids to represent their country and region on the international stage as a "junket"... how sad you are.

[ForeverRed]

Peter has been tour manager for this trip of NNSW representatives for nearly 10 years, originally NSWF and NNSWF would create a combined squad of players. But 5 years ago FNSW ceased the participation. As an A Licence coach he also coached the team for a few years when NNSWF had no TD in residence.

And maybe his ticket was booked way before Elland was ousted and the CEO position become vacant and he applied for and was successful.

Regardless of the motives the trip has become an annual occurrence for nearly a decade giving our players a football experience they will not forget.

You are obviously affilitated with the other guy that did not get the job, and the social media attacks towards Peter criticising decisions obviously made months ago speaks volumes to the saltiness of your mate not being a suitable candidate.

You and your mates are exactly what is wrong with our game and the white anting from within that never allows the game to flourish at its potential. We finally have a club person, a local administrator who has fantastic relationships with the zones and a decorated player leading our game.Who hasnt been in the job for a month, but is getting attacked that it is his fault the region doesnt have adequate representation at national and international levels for the past 14 years.

If the Ceo of Nnswf was so powerful to have input on the Jets lineup each week then you and your loser mates could justify a response. Your attacks regarding representation should be aimed at the coaches who are refusing to give our best youth a go, yet you are hell bent on criticising our new CEO for allowing our best kids to represent their country and region on the international stage as a "junket"... how sad you are.

He does have point though Magician, I can understand you standing up for your mate.

[Jim]

Peter has been tour manager for this trip of NNSW representatives for nearly 10 years, originally NSWF and NNSWF would create a combined squad of players. But 5 years ago FNSW ceased the participation. As an A Licence coach he also coached the team for a few years when NNSWF had no TD in residence.

And maybe his ticket was booked way before Elland was ousted and the CEO position become vacant and he applied for and was successful.

Regardless of the motives the trip has become an annual occurrence for nearly a decade giving our players a football experience they will not forget.

You are obviously affilitated with the other guy that did not get the job, and the social media attacks towards Peter criticising decisions obviously made months ago speaks volumes to the saltiness of your mate not being a suitable candidate.

You and your mates are exactly what is wrong with our game and the white anting from within that never allows the game to flourish at its potential. We finally have a club person, a local administrator who has fantastic relationships with the zones and a decorated player leading our game.Who hasnt been in the job for a month, but is getting attacked that it is his fault the region doesnt have adequate representation at national and international levels for the past 14 years.

If the Ceo of Nnswf was so powerful to have input on the Jets lineup each week then you and your loser mates could justify a response. Your attacks regarding representation should be aimed at the coaches who are refusing to give our best youth a go, yet you are hell bent on criticising our new CEO for allowing our best kids to represent their country and region on the international stage as a "junket"... how sad you are.

This response is defensive drivel and the personal attacks also warrants a return of serve.
First, because its always been done doesnt make it right and next its a rort NNSW can afford.

As for the personal attacks thats make you the ahole as usual.

[jessepinkman]

Peter has been tour manager for this trip of NNSW representatives for nearly 10 years, originally NSWF and NNSWF would create a combined squad of players. But 5 years ago FNSW ceased the participation. As an A Licence coach he also coached the team for a few years when NNSWF had no TD in residence.

And maybe his ticket was booked way before Elland was ousted and the CEO position become vacant and he applied for and was successful.

Regardless of the motives the trip has become an annual occurrence for nearly a decade giving our players a football experience they will not forget.

You are obviously affilitated with the other guy that did not get the job, and the social media attacks towards Peter criticising decisions obviously made months ago speaks volumes to the saltiness of your mate not being a suitable candidate.

You and your mates are exactly what is wrong with our game and the white anting from within that never allows the game to flourish at its potential. We finally have a club person, a local administrator who has fantastic relationships with the zones and a decorated player leading our game.Who hasnt been in the job for a month, but is getting attacked that it is his fault the region doesnt have adequate representation at national and international levels for the past 14 years.

If the Ceo of Nnswf was so powerful to have input on the Jets lineup each week then you and your loser mates could justify a response. Your attacks regarding representation should be aimed at the coaches who are refusing to give our best youth a go, yet you are hell bent on criticising our new CEO for allowing our best kids to represent their country and region on the international stage as a "junket"... how sad you are.

What a ridiculous post, I dont know anyone who applied for the job nor do I have any knowledge of anyone who applied for the job. I just made an observation, if you're this defensive then maybe something is there to be defensive about? I'm not sure, but I am just asking the question. When did I call it a junket too? I literally just asked why the new CEO would go on this trip.

I just am, like everyone else here, free and able to question the dollar spend of the private organisation I pay fees to.

Im a bit blown away by your response, perhaps you think im someone im not, or perhaps you're extra defensive on behalf of a 'mate'.

[Hunter403]

Back to football...there was some good football today (mixed in with some interesting refereeing and red cards in the 18s) between Westy and Kahibah youth in all grades. Both clubs really trying to develop good football teams. Great to watch.