Think you will find that Adelaide is more dispersed than the Hunter Valley ignoring regional teams and apparently they spent 2 years to come up with the plan.Originally Posted by WOW2.0
FNSW rules are different to NNSWF rules so obviously registration in two different federations don't carry over.
Clearly if parents are happy to leave Weston to play for Lambton then the travel distance isn't an issue.
Development won't count for anything if they take 18s out of PYL anyway.
I've heard from a reasonably reliable source that is indeed going to happen, that it has already been communicated to clubs.
That being a crappy decision doesn't make the even worse one of a 16-18 game season less shitty though!!!
....noteworthy...
Without 18s
Phase 1 Div B teams that stayed up would have seen NIAS in place of Rosebuds (NIAS would have finished 2nd and been playing for a spot in Div 1)
In Div A phase 1, Weston would have stayed up, and Maitland down...and I recently published what the club championship in Phase 2 would have looked like
We have just seen anecdotal discussion how relegation ripped apart the successful teams from Weston, who had their best poached away once the drop became clear...clear wide reaching consequences of this pro/rel methodology (good teams punished through club averages, now a subtle manipulation of excluding 18s from PYLB, etc)
Hoping Northern pays some attention and introduces pro/real by team, and increases the tiny season at the very least
Will be even less for the NL1 18s teams next year. Adamstown, Charlestown, Belswans, all teams that finished in the bottom 4 will go up, and imagine how that is going to be. Even worse if Adamstown come down and it is West Wallsend (majority of the 18s turned 18 this year), Kahibah, or Stags that go up.
This leaves 7 teams in the competition for U18s in NL1, so 16 games maximum because there won't be any cup games, heaps of Byes, unless Wallsend and Dudley manage to find 18s and it will only get worse as clubs who get promoted may not want to or be unable to get an U18s side. If a current team gets relegated and have to lose their 18s they may end up dropping Youth too particularly if they are unable to go straight up as they struggle to attract players who don't want to play for a club that has no U18s, so will be even less games for Div 2 and for NL1 18s.
But why would Northern care about their competitions and growing and keeping them healthy, they just want to help NPL clubs make money money off parents so they can over pay players.
I would argue that this forces the clubs to care about the full program and put an effort in to develop all teams, got a good 15s, well focus on improving all your other teams as well. Of course this won't mean jack shit if 18s get taken out of PYL, a club could be in NPL, and doesn't matter if their PYL teams are in Div 2 and League C, they will be able to attract and recruit decent players into the U18s because their 1st grade is doing well, while an NPL club that just got relegated may see clubs now losing a whole lot of U18s that they did develop.We have just seen anecdotal discussion how relegation ripped apart the successful teams from Weston, who had their best poached away once the drop became clear...clear wide reaching consequences of this pro/rel methodology (good teams punished through club averages, now a subtle manipulation of excluding 18s from PYLB, etc)
Worse losing a bunch of kids you've worked with for 4 years at 16 years old because of how 1st grade went.
Last edited by Taffy; 28-08-2024 at 12:31 PM.
Without going over this again,I would be interested to hear how you would grade 13s every year.
First 11 games
As we've all settled in the maximum number of season games is, grading phase and then a full H/A season in groups of 8 (in our infinite wisdom and ability to influence Northern at all 🤪
That would make the most sense.
Grading games could be based off the success of last season's 13s as a top of the head suggestion.
(Or make an assessment from the u12s SAP/JDL unrecorded/unpublished results.)
I'm not sure a poor average has much to do with the club not caring about all the age groups in favour of the 1 or 2 successful teams...so many factors can be at play, available talent within the team, injuries, team morale, etc.
I think it's nearly impossible to grow out of a div 2 or 3 status if they can't be graded by team...(The opportunity to grow a brand of "success" out of the squads you are getting right) short of an absolutely ruthless recruitment strategy (like Richard Hartley, or Lakes has done (Lakes also using very positive messaging around their overall direction)
So this is where your system falls apart.Theres (hopefully) 24 under 13s teams each year.11 games,no matter how you assign them isnt an even playing field.Making an assessment based on the previous years 13s is essentially what they do now and you dont think the current system is fair.Judging off JDL results is pointless and undermines the point of JDL.Plus most clubs have 22/24 kids in 12s JDL they will get whittled down to 15/16 for under 13s.You just got finished telling us that Weston lost a few players and were way worse off but cutting between 6-8 kids per club is a bigger drop in numbers how do we know they will be the same level as JDL 12s?The answer is we dont,and it shows again that while the pursuit of ultimate fairness should be praised,this system by team every year just doesnt make things any fairer that the current one while adding just as many problems if not more.First 11 games
As we've all settled in the maximum number of season games is, grading phase and then a full H/A season in groups of 8 (in our infinite wisdom and ability to influence Northern at all 🤪
That would make the most sense.
Grading games could be based off the success of last season's 13s as a top of the head suggestion.
(Or make an assessment from the u12s SAP/JDL unrecorded/unpublished results.)
[QUOTE=WOW2.0;275768]I'm not sure a poor average has much to do with the club not caring about all the age groups in favour of the 1 or 2 successful teams...so many factors can be at play, available talent within the team, injuries, team morale, etc.[/QUOTES]
Clubs and TDs forced to put together a strong program across all of youth.
More difficult not impossible, Northern's changes are going to make it much harder of course.I think it's nearly impossible to grow out of a div 2 or 3 status if they can't be graded by team...
The irony is Lakes did a good job and now will have the specter of losing 16 year olds because adults didn't play well. Rather than able to bring more talented kids into their reserves and first grade.Lakes has done (Lakes also using very positive messaging around their overall direction)
Firstly, they are all just suggestions mate
(Rest assured I have no influence with Northern)
But to your points, it is not impossible to grade like for like out of the season of SAP/JDL games, without ruining what is the purpose of this existing system (I have read through the entire curriculum, and spoken to Ron Smith who ran the much loved AIS system, and was instrumental in the documentation of the curriculum?this will not impact in any meaningful way, I assure you).
I don?t think most teams have 2 JDL teams.
I think you'll find even fewer clubs have 2 JDL teams moving forward due to the new rating system that is landing next season. I know one ?large? club has already advised their parents that they will only be in a position to carry through 1 JDL team now, as they won't be able to meet the requirements for gold status of their program (the status that allows two JDL teams per age/gender group).
I don?t get your point re: Weston?so now any talented kids they have will have to run away earlier, because those coming into 13s know there is a risk they?ll spend half the year in tier 2 (through absolutely no fault of their own)?so just fodder for poaching!
It absolutely makes things fairer, and ensures the best possible standard of matches at the various levels, like for like. Your criticism that it is unfair for 13s (because, ?how do you judge their appropriate level?), but right now we have a system that is unfair for many age groups who have found themselves shifted into Division 2 and 3, and indeed for the very poor performers in Div 1 who have had an absolutely terrible year!
My point is that Weston team went from top 6 in Div A, to being put in Div 2 but not even making the semis in Div 2 despite being the highest ranked team after phase 1.If the main reason for that was because a couple of kids moved then how good a team were they and where do they deserve to be graded next year?If your team only succeeds because of a couple of players then every team is open to the same thing happening every year which makes grading by teams just as open to flaws as keeping clubs as one group.How the hell do you even begin to grade them fairly next year?
Geez i could grade clubs based on the 12s JDL form. Then the 1st round would sort it out properly.
I prefer this newer system over the old system. But I'd prefer to have each team in their correct grade as opposed to current club grading.
If one team was in A then that could incentivise other players to stay and try to get other teams in to the As as well.
On the neg the fixtures then becomes quite complex.
As others pointed out, the player departure started the moment they realised the cub would not hold onto a div.1 spot
So if course they didn't do well in phase 2
You'll find that the relative success of all youth teams comes down to the particular dynamism of just a few key players...supported by, hopefully for that team, a relatively "high" average standard of the rest of the squad
This suggestion helps to prevent clubs being wholly targeted for poaching across the board...those quality teams can then build upon their success and perhaps manage to lure other talented players
Thats not exactly how it went down.I belive the coach also left around that time so theres more to it that is better left in the past.As for poaching,its one thing for clubs to ask after players,its entirely up to the player (and usually parents) to actually effect the move.To grade by team would require all teams to have rosters sorted by end of current season so NNSW can then assess and try to being to get a draw done.If anything in the past can tell us,its that a lot of stuff can happen between now and March kickoff.
I don't know how it went down, but others have given their observations
But for you to consider, the coach leaving can be for the same reason, remember that in most instances the coach will be a dad of one of the players. Only two clubs that I am aware of have a policy that the coach cannot be a dad, that's Jaffas and Olympic (I believe Charlestown is trying to do this too, but two coaches are in fact there coaching their sons)...so it's conceivable that the dad left, because he took his son out, to, just like the others pursue what he believed to be greener pastures.
Most rosters are all but finalised well before the end of the year (some clubs have it sorted by mid season with their aggressive recruitment!)...typically a rentention letter, it letter of offer will go out, and you'll be asked to pay a deposit ($500 deposit at one club we've recently been talking about)...of course, people can change their minds, but, more or less set already
Seriously, Whats all the fuss about. NPL youth isnt special. No one is going professional. Just pick a good coach and club that is close by that suits your kid. The team will be in a division with a decent chance for finals. I had a kid that went fringe NSL and in the end well done but no big deal and hardly worth the effort.
The wannabe egos in this town is a joke. From the coaches who arent very good, to parents who think their precious kids are going pro, to the kids themselves who really cbf. I love the kids who take the piss on the field and have fun. Some of those have some talent as well.
👏👏👏👏
Yet, we have had professionals come out of the system...your statement is wrong
As posted on the Jets Youth section, the average age of the Socceroos (at the Qatar WC) having entered a professional academy was 15.2 years of age...don't be bitter, who are any of us to stand in any one's dream...let's just ensure we have a system that maximises the opportunity for those dreams to ever be realised.
No more loser mentality
Anyone heard outcomes from last night's meeting? My contact(s) haven't got back to me.
I understand you can add South Cardiff to that list as well.
This. My son plays in a Div 1 PYL team and absolutely loves it. He enjoys the higher level training and intensity of the games, but he is acutely aware that he is nowhere near the level to play professionally one day. His goals are far more modest and achievable. If he goes onto greater things, well good for him. He's happy and has a focus, rather than vaping with his mates and getting into trouble.
There was a kid from the NCF U16s who started for the Joey's on the recent tour to the Pacific Islands. Who knows if he will go on to play professionally one day, but what he has done so far is a bloody good start.
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