I dont want to have our yearly disagreement on this as I actually agree with you that for a results based experiment it is the fairest way to go.But the logistics and downsides to it dont make it worth the hassle.It wont happen in our current structure.Any new system wont be without its flaws and its always the issue of weighing up what we are trying to achieve in youth football in this city.Originally Posted by WOW2.0
No referee or ARs for the U15s and U16s PYL games at Speers Point on Saturday, so a few parents had to do the job. Unbelievable at this age and level.
With the split not that far away and looking at both divisions the team I feel most for is Adamstown?s 13?s. They are 7 from 7 with a goal difference of +36 but because the rest of the club has gone backwards on last year they will end up in Div 3 where it looks like they can compete in Div 1. I wonder how many kids from that team stay next year.
Looking at last year the Buds stayed in Div 2 with 4 teams. They have a full compliment of teams this year and are struggling. Heard they picked up West Wallsends TD and some coaches from last year. I would think if you had ambition and you were Div 2 last year that you would chase TD and coaches from Div 1 not Div 3.
Least their first grades improved for a grand old club
Its actually very believable.We have talked at length about the lack of referees for the last 2 years and the reasons why.For 15s and 16s they would ideally love to have a ref no younger than 17/18 on the game.Kids those ages now are dropping out of reffing due to HSC/Uni, other work, and the fact that if they are players (most are) they are expected to be available both days over every weekend of the season to play and ref.Kids that age have more interests and when the alternative is going to work just to cop abuse from parents and coaches then I can understand why they would rather be going to the beach or the movies or doing any other job which doesnt expose them to being abused.Add to that those age refs are now being offered ZPL gamedays which are better environments (better football/more respectful players/way less parent abuse/better money) the choice is pretty easy for a lot of them.They need more refs desperately,so all they can do is encourage kids to want to do it and do their best to keep the ones they already have.Hopefully theres plenty of kids in your sons team who are refs and everyone else on the forum is encouraging theirs to do it as well.
There were multiple venues where there were no referees appointments on Saturday. Not withstanding sapdads point on referee retention etc, there’s a disconnect between “Northerns referees” and “community referees” where it seems that officials are forbidden from doing both. Additionally the costs to become a referee are ridiculous, if northern and the zones were fair dinkum about getting referees on board they would make it free to register and provide free equipment for refs as well.
Do you think they last the year?
Lots of player movement i think, specially players that think there Div 1 and drop to div 2 post decoupling?
I don't like it not many players play for the club now but this format has created it and you can't blame some kids moving to stay in div 1 specially when there team was competing well but other ages in the club aren't.
Correct.When you register to become a referee you have to choose between Community,NPL and I think back in the day it was ZPL.You couldnt move between the 3 levels.ZPL has been folded into the NPL space now so they share referees but I can only assume once you register for community then you are appointed by the different Football Zone on for matchdays.Im not sure but I was always under the impression that each Zone ran their own referees recruitment as well (could be wrong).I am on record wishing referees could move between community and NPL but I assume the logistics would be insane trying to organise so many games from one location.As for the cost,yes it can always be cheaper and younger kids growing at a rapid pace are replacing multiple shirts and socks several times over the years (to keep all colours available every week).Referees do get paid more than your average weekend kids job though and it is tax free so the net position is generally better long term compared to many other jobs.
Rosebuds 13s have had 3 x 1 goal wins (2 of them against clubs that will be in Div 3) and one 20 goal victory so the stats are a little misleading.Id be pumping the brakes if they think they can compete with the likes of Magic and Olympic just yet.For comparison Rosebuds had a good 13s team last year who were 1 point off first at the break then didnt even make the finals by the end of phase 2.My best advice would be to stick together if they are happy,enjoy their football and grow as a team and individuals.
Last edited by sapdad; 15-04-2025 at 11:28 AM.
sapdad, hopefully they do stay together, from what I understand the majority of the team are from the Rosebuds JDL programe, so you would assume a fair investment has already been made by the club. Some may look for the shiny lights of DIV1, but honestly if the kids are having fun hopefully the parents can steer them away, plenty of stories of kids leaving only to be disapointed the next year.
I wonder how many key players stayed after the drop, shifting clubs mid season, impacting how they went in the 2nd half of the season
It does entice the club to focus on their entire youth program rather than just 1 or 2 teams and ignoring the rest.
People who want the split to be at a team level never talk about what happens at the end of the season and how it will work for the next year.
Latest Div 1 table.
Screenshot 2025-04-15 135611.jpg
Dude, I get it, I understand what the issues are surrounding referee retention. And yes my son is a ref.
It is just a bit hard to take when one of the AR has no shoes on and has literally no idea what he is doing or where he should be standing. We should be able to do better than this.
I dont think any from this particular team left but there was another example of a team that did well in the first phase but the club went down and a few of their better players left.Not an idea outcome at all.
This is a great point and hopefully something that can be built upon.Theres some clubs out there with really good JDL programs that are starting to translate into good 13s and 14s teams.The hope is always to have those kids stay all the way through so if there are some incentives or rules around retention it might push all clubs to develop rather than recruit.But I understand its always a balance and sometimes kids just want to move clubs.Obviously theres no foolproof solution.
Clubs mandated to having 'x' amount of their registered players made to do the course and be active refs or at the very least have incentives for clubs that do have a lot of refs on their books.Nothing is going to change until we get a lot more kids (or parents) signing up to do the job.Its a simple equation at the moment.Not enough refs=more gamedays like what you just experienced.Everyone agrees no one wants that.
There are neglected teams and players in a lot of clubs, including tier 1.
How does a club grow out of div 2 or 3...best players constantly poached, attraction of lower division to bring in good footballers (lack of), team success that an individual can impact drowned away by a collectivised under performance
However, putting through a good batch of say, 13s from your JDL can attract more success...and this is how clubs can improve as a whole
As for how it would work for the next year, simple, lower team in each grade is relegated, other promoted into their place...it's not hard
My understanding is that most of the PYLB games were set down for Saturday. With many youth referees also playing PYLB, that would mean there were not enough available refs to handle all the games. Then on Sunday, with far fewer PYLB games, there were apparently new and young refs wanting to officiate and not enough young age games to give them. If this is true, a more equitable split of fixtures would help to get more games covered with official refs. And attracting new refs from outside those that play youth football would also assist.
That’s a poor reflection on Northern & the home club (assuming they knew there were no refs appointed) than the guy who jumped in and had a go. He’s likely rocked up to watch his kid & got thrown in the deep end. Good on him for having a crack, but it’s the club & association that have to be better here
That again is a poor reflection on Northern. They need to balance the schedule better
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