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Thread: The Politics/Religion/Conspiracies Deathmatch Thread

  1. #761
    infant member plague's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blackmac79 View Post
    Looking at a single service that is provided, one that will almost always run at a loss unless people decided it is worthwhile paying several $ per letter.

    Point is that the whole thing is subsidy free, and many "franchisees" are turning profits.

    Agree it's not what it was though. Just don't buy the government hype around this sudden urgent need to sell the thing off
    Yeah but overall the service is inefficient, hence why its losing money. You cant pick out the good bits and ignore the shitty bits.

    BUT

    you cant cut services to country areas etc that rely on it just because a particular arm of the business doesnt run a profit. and parts of the service (namely the growth in the area of small parcel deliveries with the explosion of online shopping) are sitting there waiting to be run smarter to help the business run better.

    SOLUTION:

    bring in private enterprise to encourage efficiency and innovation (sadly, Govt departments just arent set up to run like that) BUT maintain control to make sure essential services arent cut.

    HOW DO WE ACHIEVE THIS BALANCE????

    I dunno, maybe lease off 49% and maintain control the other 51%.


    WHO WOULD HAVE THUNK IT???????

    oh wait, someone already did.
    Quote Originally Posted by MFKS View Post
    And I don't argue with FR. The bloke is a legend and deserves great praise for his contributions to football in the Hunter.
    He is also the second best poster on the entire Foz behind you
    Quote Originally Posted by parksey View Post
    sometimes there's more to life than just winning
    Quote Originally Posted by ForeverRed View Post
    What a deadset ****ing coward **** you are
    Quote Originally Posted by MFKS View Post
    Seems like I am WRONG

  2. #762
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    Quote Originally Posted by plague View Post
    cool cool.

    So we are talking about the 'poles and wires' yeah?
    Go look at the Post Office and see where holding on to a govt funded 'asset' too long gets you.
    Govt obviously thinks that assets like poles and wires/ports/generators etc have a shelf life and if they can get good money for them now to fund further economic development and create more govt 'assets' (that then can then generate more income from) then they should do it.

    Going off Labors numbers the 'poles and wires' generate $1.7b per year for the govt. leasing 49% of that means they 'lose' $850m per annum but get $20b up front (remembering the Govt will still get that other $850m per year from the remaining 51%).

    Say the advancement in technology of renewable energies (not to mention the Nuclear debate)determines that traditional means of delivering power to your home makes the reliance on these 'poles and wires' less important and therefore less valuable? Do we still make the $1.7 per annum from them in the future? who knows?

    What? could that really happen? oh wait thats exactly whats happening to the Post Office. you think anyone 30 years ago would dare have thought that we could send correspondence without going through the govt controlled monopoly? no way.

    State govt is striking while the iron is hot. i can see where they are coming from.

    Also, considering probably 99% of your daily interactions are with products/services provided by the private sector I think its safe to assume you have survived the rigours of dealing with them yeah?

    Im sure dealing with one more "big bad business" in your day wont hurt.

    Of course once Skynet gets hold of me feel free to mock and bellow to the world 'I told you so'.

    Cheers,
    Plague
    aka Mr Smartarse.


    (Anyway as Dunster said we are all living in a vacuum where right is left and left is right so whats it matter yeah?).
    Can you even read proper homie? You keep prattling on about poles.Obviously you need the might of the sheep quiz gang behind you.
    Quote Originally Posted by pv4 View Post
    You are easily the worst person on this forum. Srs.

  3. #763
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Dunster View Post
    The Australian government has absolutely no budget constraint in terms of spending in Australian dollars.

    In simple terms the government is able to purchase all goods and services available that are denominated in Australian Dollars.

    Learn how to construct a stock flow consistent macroeconomic model and then get back to us.
    Obviously you did half a home economics course and failed. There was a supplementary course that went with that, the " how not to sound like a total arsehole" course, which you must have skipped.
    Quote Originally Posted by pv4 View Post
    You are easily the worst person on this forum. Srs.

  4. #764
    infant member plague's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by My2BobsWorth View Post
    Can you even read proper homie? You keep prattling on about poles.Obviously you need the might of the sheep quiz gang behind you.
    should i spell it 'powls' so it makes more sense to you?

    here to help.
    Quote Originally Posted by MFKS View Post
    And I don't argue with FR. The bloke is a legend and deserves great praise for his contributions to football in the Hunter.
    He is also the second best poster on the entire Foz behind you
    Quote Originally Posted by parksey View Post
    sometimes there's more to life than just winning
    Quote Originally Posted by ForeverRed View Post
    What a deadset ****ing coward **** you are
    Quote Originally Posted by MFKS View Post
    Seems like I am WRONG

  5. #765
    infant member plague's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by My2BobsWorth View Post
    Obviously you did half a home economics course and failed. There was a supplementary course that went with that, the " how not to sound like a total arsehole" course, which you must have skipped.
    I enjoy it very much when someone responds to a post they dont understand by making a fart noise with their mouth.


    In other news, how is your sewing and cooking Dunster?
    Quote Originally Posted by MFKS View Post
    And I don't argue with FR. The bloke is a legend and deserves great praise for his contributions to football in the Hunter.
    He is also the second best poster on the entire Foz behind you
    Quote Originally Posted by parksey View Post
    sometimes there's more to life than just winning
    Quote Originally Posted by ForeverRed View Post
    What a deadset ****ing coward **** you are
    Quote Originally Posted by MFKS View Post
    Seems like I am WRONG

  6. #766
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    Quote Originally Posted by plague View Post
    I enjoy it very much when someone responds to a post they dont understand by making a fart noise with their mouth.


    In other news, how is your sewing and cooking Dunster?
    As opposed to the slurping sound on Dunnys dick?
    Quote Originally Posted by pv4 View Post
    You are easily the worst person on this forum. Srs.

  7. #767
    infant member plague's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by My2BobsWorth View Post
    As opposed to the slurping sound on Dunnys dick?
    Just be sure you're sensitive to others when publicly displaying your fantasies. Some people aren't the same persuasion as you and it could make them feel uncomfortable.

    So we're back to gay marriage now? I'm a supporter, so at least we agree on that.

    Anyway the mods will be here in s sec telling us all to pipe down so unless you have anymore homophobic slurs and general ignorance to spout lets get back on topic hey.

    Cheers.

  8. #768
    in awe of baz GazFish35's Avatar
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    The sooner this election is over the better.
    Hot tip.
    Doesn't matter who you vote for, you always end up with a politician.

  9. #769
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    Can we get back to talking religion again???

  10. #770
    infant member plague's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GazFish35 View Post
    The sooner this election is over the better.
    Hot tip.
    Doesn't matter who you vote for, you always end up with a politician.
    State?
    I actually think this one has been quite civil.
    Even the scare campaign ads are at least watchable (except the Nurses one, **** the Nurses Union).
    At least both sides seem have some policies to digest.

  11. #771
    Senior Member Jeterpool's Avatar
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    I often log into this thread thinking it might have turned into a thread like the "tennis thread". Alas no
    Quote Originally Posted by Grimario View Post
    Great. He's gone from Liaoning Whowin to Newcastle Wholose.
    The Championship Chronicles - The Jetstream's review of the 2007/08 season. www.newcastlefootball.net/chronicles

  12. #772
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeterpool View Post
    I often log into this thread thinking it might have turned into a thread like the "tennis thread". Alas no
    The day photos of Jacquie Lambie are flap material is the day to end it all

  13. #773
    Senior Member militiamon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by plague View Post
    SOLUTION:

    bring in private enterprise to encourage efficiency and innovation (sadly, Govt departments just arent set up to run like that) BUT maintain control to make sure essential services arent cut.
    You're 100% right provided that the private enterprise is more efficient and innovative. Is that a universal truth?
    Genuine question since I know sfa about this area, but I'm assuming there have been some studies done on it.

    Also, there are some obvious benefits to the government/people in retaining such assets, as you yourself point out with the example of a letters service for country peeps.
    The position that pro-nationalisation people would hold is that there are some essential services in society which, while expensive, are essential to be retained so that there is a greater level of control, to stop inequality, make delivery easier etc.

  14. #774
    in awe of baz GazFish35's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by militiamon View Post
    the example of a letters service for country peeps.
    Damn country people expecting govt to support their "lifestyle choices"

  15. #775
    infant member plague's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by militiamon View Post
    Also, there are some obvious benefits to the government/people in retaining such assets, as you yourself point out with the example of a letters service for country peeps.
    The position that pro-nationalisation people would hold is that there are some essential services in society which, while expensive, are essential to be retained so that there is a greater level of control, to stop inequality, make delivery easier etc.
    Agree 100%.
    This is why I'm a big fan of the 49/51 split.
    The best of both worlds.
    Govts should always be willing to embrace the private sectors strength whilst ALWAYS remembering (and having the power) to do their jobs, which is act in the best interests of ALL Australians.
    Quote Originally Posted by MFKS View Post
    And I don't argue with FR. The bloke is a legend and deserves great praise for his contributions to football in the Hunter.
    He is also the second best poster on the entire Foz behind you
    Quote Originally Posted by parksey View Post
    sometimes there's more to life than just winning
    Quote Originally Posted by ForeverRed View Post
    What a deadset ****ing coward **** you are
    Quote Originally Posted by MFKS View Post
    Seems like I am WRONG

  16. #776
    infant member plague's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GazFish35 View Post
    Damn country people expecting govt to support their "lifestyle choices"
    Oh man I was waiting for someone to go there.
    So what's your thoughts? Ray-cess, or not ray-cess?
    Quote Originally Posted by MFKS View Post
    And I don't argue with FR. The bloke is a legend and deserves great praise for his contributions to football in the Hunter.
    He is also the second best poster on the entire Foz behind you
    Quote Originally Posted by parksey View Post
    sometimes there's more to life than just winning
    Quote Originally Posted by ForeverRed View Post
    What a deadset ****ing coward **** you are
    Quote Originally Posted by MFKS View Post
    Seems like I am WRONG

  17. #777
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    Quote Originally Posted by militiamon View Post
    You're 100% right provided that the private enterprise is more efficient

    and innovative. Is that a universal truth?
    Genuine question since I know sfa about this area, but

    I'm assuming there have been some studies done on it.

    Also, there are some obvious benefits to the

    government/people in retaining such assets, as you yourself point out with the example of a letters

    service for country peeps.
    The position that pro-nationalisation people would hold is that there are

    some essential services in society which, while expensive, are essential to be retained so that

    there is a greater level of control, to stop inequality, make delivery easier etc.
    Arguing

    that private sector is more efficient than government sector is about as scientific as arguing the

    earth is flat.

    The evidence suggests that the private sector is less efficient and by a considerable

    margin. The reason being self imposed compliance regimes and the ability to become insolvent.
    Government red tape is minimal in comparison and insolvency is impossible for a country that is a

    monopolist issuer of its own money such as Australia.

    The Abbott Hockey Regime found this out the

    hard way when a report they commissioned completely backfired on them in October 2014.Here is a

    small snippet from the report.
    … by laying down the law – imposing rules on ourselves – in

    areas as diverse as human resources (HR), information technology (IT), finance, legal, marketing

    and executive governance.

    The time required for employees to comply with self-imposed rules has

    become a crippling burden. Middle managers and senior executives are chalking up 8.9 hours a week

    complying with the rules corporates set for themselves, with other staff spending 6.4 hours.

    http://www2.deloitte.com/au/en/pages...t-of-your-own-

    way.html [ Nothing in the report surprised anyone with any understanding of economics]

    Moving on -

    Think about this.

    If Aggregate demand is at a level not compatible with full employment - How can

    the private sector increase aggregate demand to restore full employment ?
    Answer is it can't.
    Government on the other hand can increase aggregate demand by simply increasing spending.
    They don't

    need to print money, dip into any prior savings, or even increase taxes to do so..

    Get away from

    thinking taxes fund government spending and that government borrow money to fund deficits and you

    will be a lot closer to how the economy actually operates in the 21st century.

    Yes, it's that

    simple.

    Another area of inefficiency in the private sector is wage determination. There is

    absolutely no relationship between wages / incomes and contribution to society or indeed

    efficiency. I'll provide a link below for you to investigate if you like.

    http://www.neweconomics.org/sites/ne...A_Bit_Rich.pdf
    Last edited by The Dunster; 14-03-2015 at 12:39 PM.

  18. #778
    infant member plague's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Dunster View Post
    Arguing that private sector is more efficient than government sector is about as scientific as arguing the earth is flat.

    The evidence suggests that the private sector is less efficient and by a considerable margin. The reason being self imposed compliance regimes and the ability to become insolvent.
    Government red tape is minimal in comparison and insolvency is impossible for a country that is a monopolist issuer of its own money such as Australia.

    Think about this.

    If Aggregate demand is at a level not compatible with full employment - How can the private sector increase aggregate demand to restore full employment ?
    Answer is it can't.
    Government on the other hand can increase aggregate demand by simply increasing spending.
    They don't need to print money, dip into any prior savings, or even increase taxes to do so..

    Get away from thinking taxes fund government spending and that government borrow money to fund deficits and you will be a lot closer to how the economy actually operates in the 21st century.

    Yes, it's that simple.
    Yeah your theory is fine but saying that a Govt is better at running a business because they can move the goalposts whenever they please doesn't make them 'better' (it does make them smarter though doesn't it).

    All I can say is that based on my life experience companies make way better choices when investing their own money versus spending someone else's.

    Look at local govt, each dept is given a budget each year and their goal and culture is not to spend the money wisely, or to save money where possible. But the culture is to spend ALL of it regardless as that way they get the same (or more) budget the following year. The public sector for the most part get 'punished' for saving money.
    And when every dept wants more money the council oblidges by raising revenue through rates (that's why NCC ratepayers are about to get slugged with a big rate rise).
    This is exactly like you describe but that's not running a more efficient business by any stretch of the imagination.
    Quote Originally Posted by MFKS View Post
    And I don't argue with FR. The bloke is a legend and deserves great praise for his contributions to football in the Hunter.
    He is also the second best poster on the entire Foz behind you
    Quote Originally Posted by parksey View Post
    sometimes there's more to life than just winning
    Quote Originally Posted by ForeverRed View Post
    What a deadset ****ing coward **** you are
    Quote Originally Posted by MFKS View Post
    Seems like I am WRONG

  19. #779
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    Quote Originally Posted by plague View Post
    Agree 100%.
    This is why I'm a big fan of the 49/51 split.
    The best of both worlds.
    Govts should always be willing to embrace the private sectors strength whilst ALWAYS remembering (and having the power) to do their jobs, which is act in the best interests of ALL Australians.
    By strengths are you talking about the ability of the private sector to inflict self imposed compliance regimes on to their workers which kill productivity stone dead ? Or are you referring to the private sectors ability to become insolvent due to a lack of aggregate demand or indeed speculative practices gone wrong such as in the case of the GFC ?

  20. #780
    infant member plague's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Dunster View Post
    By strengths are you talking about the ability of the private sector to inflict self imposed compliance regimes on to their workers which kill productivity stone dead ? Or are you referring to the private sectors ability to become insolvent due to a lack of aggregate demand or indeed speculative practices gone wrong such as in the case of the GFC ?
    Oh come on, saying all companies should be run like the public sector is absurd.
    Private companies work on the rules imposed on them.
    Govts make their own rules.
    Not a level playing field.
    Quote Originally Posted by MFKS View Post
    And I don't argue with FR. The bloke is a legend and deserves great praise for his contributions to football in the Hunter.
    He is also the second best poster on the entire Foz behind you
    Quote Originally Posted by parksey View Post
    sometimes there's more to life than just winning
    Quote Originally Posted by ForeverRed View Post
    What a deadset ****ing coward **** you are
    Quote Originally Posted by MFKS View Post
    Seems like I am WRONG

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